Mailing List Archive: Pictures of Bangkok riots

Pictures of Bangkok riots

Apr 14, 2009, 4:24 AM

Post #1 of 9 (2509 views)

The 13th I took 70 pictures of the fight between the red shirts and the
army. I was in the first lines when the soldiers were shot at and
molotov cocktails were thrown. The 14th I took pictures of the situation
around government house in a more peacefull setting after the army had
disbanded the red shirts.

Even though I have refused for 2,5 years to add any more of my knowledge
to the Dutch wikipedia about thailand because of the bunch of idiotic
civil servants ruling the place as if it is their own personal fiefdom I
decided to give a couple of pictures.

Today 5 of the 19 pictures were put up for deletion ... and why ....
because I forgot to say they were CC-BY-SA like the other 14 .... anyone
with a bunch of brains would have asked me at my Talk page to add the
license or would have done it themselves as they could safely assume
that I would give them the same license as the other pictures .....

But no the damn civil servants put them up for deletion.

This is really hurting especially since I have done so much for the
Dutch wikipedia and because for the first 6 pictures I was in a
situation of violence. I regret deeply that I have donated these
pictures to the wikimedia foundation and I hope that they will be
deleted. As Soon As Possible.

And do not suggest Commons. That project is even worse. I would need a
week just to study all of their idiocies.

Waerth/Walter van Kalken

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Re: Pictures of Bangkok riots [ In reply to ]

waerth at asianet

Apr 14, 2009, 4:44 AM

Post #2 of 9 (2438 views)

Permalink

And as a thank you for the pictures I am being blocked.

Waerth
> The 13th I took 70 pictures of the fight between the red shirts and the
> army. I was in the first lines when the soldiers were shot at and
> molotov cocktails were thrown. The 14th I took pictures of the situation
> around government house in a more peacefull setting after the army had
> disbanded the red shirts.
>
> Even though I have refused for 2,5 years to add any more of my knowledge
> to the Dutch wikipedia about thailand because of the bunch of idiotic
> civil servants ruling the place as if it is their own personal fiefdom I
> decided to give a couple of pictures.
>
> Today 5 of the 19 pictures were put up for deletion ... and why ....
> because I forgot to say they were CC-BY-SA like the other 14 .... anyone
> with a bunch of brains would have asked me at my Talk page to add the
> license or would have done it themselves as they could safely assume
> that I would give them the same license as the other pictures .....
>
> But no the damn civil servants put them up for deletion.
>
> This is really hurting especially since I have done so much for the
> Dutch wikipedia and because for the first 6 pictures I was in a
> situation of violence. I regret deeply that I have donated these
> pictures to the wikimedia foundation and I hope that they will be
> deleted. As Soon As Possible.
>
> And do not suggest Commons. That project is even worse. I would need a
> week just to study all of their idiocies.
>
> Waerth/Walter van Kalken
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>
>
>
>

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Re: Pictures of Bangkok riots [ In reply to ]

swatjester at gmail

Apr 14, 2009, 5:10 AM

Post #3 of 9 (2438 views)

Permalink

Waerth;

What were the reasons given for the blocking? Also, I understand if you're
upset and don't want to upload them any more, but if you like, send me the
best several of the shots (with caption please) and I will upload them to
English Wikipedia.

-Dan

On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 7:44 AM, Waerth <waerth@asianet.co.th> wrote:

> And as a thank you for the pictures I am being blocked.
>
> Waerth
> > The 13th I took 70 pictures of the fight between the red shirts and the
> > army. I was in the first lines when the soldiers were shot at and
> > molotov cocktails were thrown. The 14th I took pictures of the situation
> > around government house in a more peacefull setting after the army had
> > disbanded the red shirts.
> >
> > Even though I have refused for 2,5 years to add any more of my knowledge
> > to the Dutch wikipedia about thailand because of the bunch of idiotic
> > civil servants ruling the place as if it is their own personal fiefdom I
> > decided to give a couple of pictures.
> >
> > Today 5 of the 19 pictures were put up for deletion ... and why ....
> > because I forgot to say they were CC-BY-SA like the other 14 .... anyone
> > with a bunch of brains would have asked me at my Talk page to add the
> > license or would have done it themselves as they could safely assume
> > that I would give them the same license as the other pictures .....
> >
> > But no the damn civil servants put them up for deletion.
> >
> > This is really hurting especially since I have done so much for the
> > Dutch wikipedia and because for the first 6 pictures I was in a
> > situation of violence. I regret deeply that I have donated these
> > pictures to the wikimedia foundation and I hope that they will be
> > deleted. As Soon As Possible.
> >
> > And do not suggest Commons. That project is even worse. I would need a
> > week just to study all of their idiocies.
> >
> > Waerth/Walter van Kalken
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > foundation-l mailing list
> > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

--
Dan Rosenthal
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Re: Pictures of Bangkok riots [ In reply to ]

chiesa.marco at gmail

Apr 14, 2009, 5:11 AM

Post #4 of 9 (2439 views)

Permalink

On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 1:24 PM, Waerth <waerth@asianet.co.th> wrote:

>
> Today 5 of the 19 pictures were put up for deletion ... and why ....
> because I forgot to say they were CC-BY-SA like the other 14 .... anyone
> with a bunch of brains would have asked me at my Talk page to add the
> license or would have done it themselves as they could safely assume
> that I would give them the same license as the other pictures .....

I see you got a message in your talk page, I'm pretty sure the deletion
process would have stopped immediately after you put the license you forgot.
By not putting the license tag themselves they're protecting your author's
rights, as they can't be sure you really wanted to license the photos as
cc-by-sa. God knows, maybe you would have written a pissed off email saying
that "the damn civil servants" license your images without asking you...

>
> But no the damn civil servants put them up for deletion.
>

Like I guess they would have done with anyone's images, including another
fellow admin

>
> This is really hurting especially since I have done so much for the
> Dutch wikipedia and because for the first 6 pictures I was in a
> situation of violence. I regret deeply that I have donated these
> pictures to the wikimedia foundation and I hope that they will be
> deleted. As Soon As Possible.

You know what? Tagging the other 5 images would have taken much less time
than writing this email, and you would have pissed off fewer people.

Cruccone
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Re: Pictures of Bangkok riots [ In reply to ]

swatjester at gmail

Apr 14, 2009, 5:20 AM

Post #5 of 9 (2450 views)

Permalink

In response to my own email, Google Translate gives me the impression that
you were blocked for flipping out [1] and becoming horrendously uncivil [2]
with your colleagues, in response to the deletion issue.

*1:
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=n&u=http%3A%2F%2Fnl.wikipedia.org%2Fw%2Findex.php%3Ftitle%3DSpeciaal%253ALogboeken%26type%3Dblock%26user%3DWaerth%26page%3D%26year%3D%26month%3D-1&sl=nl&tl=en
*2:
http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fnl.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FOverleg_gebruiker%3AWaerth&sl=nl&tl=en&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

-Dan

On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 8:10 AM, Dan Rosenthal <swatjester@gmail.com> wrote:

> Waerth;
>
> What were the reasons given for the blocking? Also, I understand if you're
> upset and don't want to upload them any more, but if you like, send me the
> best several of the shots (with caption please) and I will upload them to
> English Wikipedia.
>
> -Dan
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 7:44 AM, Waerth <waerth@asianet.co.th> wrote:
>
>> And as a thank you for the pictures I am being blocked.
>>
>> Waerth
>> > The 13th I took 70 pictures of the fight between the red shirts and the
>> > army. I was in the first lines when the soldiers were shot at and
>> > molotov cocktails were thrown. The 14th I took pictures of the situation
>> > around government house in a more peacefull setting after the army had
>> > disbanded the red shirts.
>> >
>> > Even though I have refused for 2,5 years to add any more of my knowledge
>> > to the Dutch wikipedia about thailand because of the bunch of idiotic
>> > civil servants ruling the place as if it is their own personal fiefdom I
>> > decided to give a couple of pictures.
>> >
>> > Today 5 of the 19 pictures were put up for deletion ... and why ....
>> > because I forgot to say they were CC-BY-SA like the other 14 .... anyone
>> > with a bunch of brains would have asked me at my Talk page to add the
>> > license or would have done it themselves as they could safely assume
>> > that I would give them the same license as the other pictures .....
>> >
>> > But no the damn civil servants put them up for deletion.
>> >
>> > This is really hurting especially since I have done so much for the
>> > Dutch wikipedia and because for the first 6 pictures I was in a
>> > situation of violence. I regret deeply that I have donated these
>> > pictures to the wikimedia foundation and I hope that they will be
>> > deleted. As Soon As Possible.
>> >
>> > And do not suggest Commons. That project is even worse. I would need a
>> > week just to study all of their idiocies.
>> >
>> > Waerth/Walter van Kalken
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > foundation-l mailing list
>> > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> foundation-l mailing list
>> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Dan Rosenthal
>

--
Dan Rosenthal
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Re: Pictures of Bangkok riots [ In reply to ]

sterkebak at gmail

Apr 14, 2009, 5:21 AM

Post #6 of 9 (2441 views)

Permalink

The blocking reason is a personal attack to the deleting admin (Not
complete sure of that), but I understand that is solved now.

Walter thank you very much for uploading those pictures!

huib

--
Leave nothing but footprints, take nothing but pictures

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:SterkeBak

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Re: Pictures of Bangkok riots [ In reply to ]

waerth at asianet

Apr 14, 2009, 5:23 AM

Post #7 of 9 (2438 views)

Permalink

When I joined wikipedia 5 years ago we had something called ASSUME GOOD
FAITH. That meant that you didn't nominate stuff for deletion first. You
ASKED someone first! I have been on the projects for well over 5 years
now, I have written over 1000 articles. People could ask first. How is
the project hurt if someone waits a day instead of within an hour
nominating something for deletion without asking first.

The problem is all these selfmade programs with which the admins do
their adminning. They just press a button and everything is done. No
brains are used anymore. You could have a monkey be an admin on
wikipedia and no-one would notice the difference.

Wikipedia used to be a human project once. It is now ruled by robots and
automated responses. Which means that people have forgotten that if you
see an experienced user ERR on the wrong you ask him first and not
immediately put something up for deletion. Another wikipedian, Jojan
asked me politely first so I did what he asked. Ciell put up for
deletion first and only after I got angry she asked ... wrong order!

Waerth

And no I will not add the license myself, I am waiting for Ciell to do it.

> On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 1:24 PM, Waerth <waerth@asianet.co.th> wrote:
>
>
>> Today 5 of the 19 pictures were put up for deletion ... and why ....
>> because I forgot to say they were CC-BY-SA like the other 14 .... anyone
>> with a bunch of brains would have asked me at my Talk page to add the
>> license or would have done it themselves as they could safely assume
>> that I would give them the same license as the other pictures .....
>>
>
>
> I see you got a message in your talk page, I'm pretty sure the deletion
> process would have stopped immediately after you put the license you forgot.
> By not putting the license tag themselves they're protecting your author's
> rights, as they can't be sure you really wanted to license the photos as
> cc-by-sa. God knows, maybe you would have written a pissed off email saying
> that "the damn civil servants" license your images without asking you...
>
>
>> But no the damn civil servants put them up for deletion.
>>
>>
>
> Like I guess they would have done with anyone's images, including another
> fellow admin
>
>
>> This is really hurting especially since I have done so much for the
>> Dutch wikipedia and because for the first 6 pictures I was in a
>> situation of violence. I regret deeply that I have donated these
>> pictures to the wikimedia foundation and I hope that they will be
>> deleted. As Soon As Possible.
>>
>
>
> You know what? Tagging the other 5 images would have taken much less time
> than writing this email, and you would have pissed off fewer people.
>
> Cruccone
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>
>
>
>

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Re: Pictures of Bangkok riots [ In reply to ]

waerth at asianet

Apr 14, 2009, 6:07 AM

Post #8 of 9 (2816 views)

Permalink

Well with the way the Dutch moderators are they deserve this.

The blocking moderator JacobH said on nl.wikipedia that I have:
"threathened the blocking mod with violence" Which is pathetic as he has
no proof and just ask the unblocking mod. This is LIBEL pure and simple.
(http://nl.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Overleg_gebruiker%3AWaerth&diff=16408975&oldid=16408950)

Here you can see that the unblocking moderator refutes this:
(http://nl.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Overleg_gebruiker%3AWaerth&diff=16409304&oldid=16408975)

Right now in Wikipedia there is a statement that I have threathened
someone with physical violence. Which I have clearly never done.

This is the average level of the moderation on the Dutch wikipedia.

I demand this to be oversighted out as this is libel pure and simple.

Unfortunately when this is oversighted out I cannot start a desysop
against this mod.

Waerth

> In response to my own email, Google Translate gives me the impression that
> you were blocked for flipping out [1] and becoming horrendously uncivil [2]
> with your colleagues, in response to the deletion issue.
>
> *1:
> http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=n&u=http%3A%2F%2Fnl.wikipedia.org%2Fw%2Findex.php%3Ftitle%3DSpeciaal%253ALogboeken%26type%3Dblock%26user%3DWaerth%26page%3D%26year%3D%26month%3D-1&sl=nl&tl=en
> *2:
> http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fnl.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FOverleg_gebruiker%3AWaerth&sl=nl&tl=en&hl=en&ie=UTF-8
>
> -Dan
>
> On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 8:10 AM, Dan Rosenthal <swatjester@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>> Waerth;
>>
>> What were the reasons given for the blocking? Also, I understand if you're
>> upset and don't want to upload them any more, but if you like, send me the
>> best several of the shots (with caption please) and I will upload them to
>> English Wikipedia.
>>
>> -Dan
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 7:44 AM, Waerth <waerth@asianet.co.th> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> And as a thank you for the pictures I am being blocked.
>>>
>>> Waerth
>>>
>>>> The 13th I took 70 pictures of the fight between the red shirts and the
>>>> army. I was in the first lines when the soldiers were shot at and
>>>> molotov cocktails were thrown. The 14th I took pictures of the situation
>>>> around government house in a more peacefull setting after the army had
>>>> disbanded the red shirts.
>>>>
>>>> Even though I have refused for 2,5 years to add any more of my knowledge
>>>> to the Dutch wikipedia about thailand because of the bunch of idiotic
>>>> civil servants ruling the place as if it is their own personal fiefdom I
>>>> decided to give a couple of pictures.
>>>>
>>>> Today 5 of the 19 pictures were put up for deletion ... and why ....
>>>> because I forgot to say they were CC-BY-SA like the other 14 .... anyone
>>>> with a bunch of brains would have asked me at my Talk page to add the
>>>> license or would have done it themselves as they could safely assume
>>>> that I would give them the same license as the other pictures .....
>>>>
>>>> But no the damn civil servants put them up for deletion.
>>>>
>>>> This is really hurting especially since I have done so much for the
>>>> Dutch wikipedia and because for the first 6 pictures I was in a
>>>> situation of violence. I regret deeply that I have donated these
>>>> pictures to the wikimedia foundation and I hope that they will be
>>>> deleted. As Soon As Possible.
>>>>
>>>> And do not suggest Commons. That project is even worse. I would need a
>>>> week just to study all of their idiocies.
>>>>
>>>> Waerth/Walter van Kalken
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> foundation-l mailing list
>>>> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>>>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> foundation-l mailing list
>>> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Dan Rosenthal
>>
>>
>
>
>
>

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Re: Pictures of Bangkok riots [ In reply to ]

hofmanj at aldebaran

Apr 14, 2009, 9:33 AM

Post #9 of 9 (2506 views)

Permalink

Very generally:

It is quite complicated to keep an eye on all files comming into Wikipedia
or Commons. No wonder admins delete those without _absolutely needed_
information provided by its uploader without further investigation.
Notification of being doing it so is just enough. If one wants to care
about legal purity of the project, such decisions must be made sometimes.
Admin's very often delete material which they like but something is wrong
or missing.

There is no need for being angry if someone's images are deleted. It is
really easy to undelete the images in case the information is provided
later.

It would be a blunder to add a license "in good faith". This is only and
only author's right.

No idea why uploading own images should be complicated in Commons. It
hardly can be easier. The whole process is very nice to its user.

If somebody wants very fine admins' work and behaviour, he or she should
at least try to do the same. If somebody calls for a good faith, he or she
should act in the good faith too.

Jiri

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