Mailing List Archive

VERP
Andi Gutmans <andi@vipe.technion.ac.il> writes:
>
>Anyone want to define VERP for me? I keep on seeing verp verp and it just
>doesn't mean anything to me. Is it like a Very Extraordinary Relay
>Protocol? :)
>Am i the only ignorany one that doesn't know what it means?
>Pardon me for flooding the list for something list this.
>

It's a new term in the qmail community. It's an acronym for
"Variable Envelope Return Paths". It used to be called the
"owner hack". It's what makes the envelope sender address on
messages from the qmail list so long and complex.

From RFCVERP, in the qmail 1.00 distribution:


1. Introduction

The fundamental problem in managing a large mailing list is matching
bounce messages to subscription addresses.

Often a bounce message refers to a failing address that does not
appear on the mailing list. One of the mailing list subscribers is
forwarding messages to that address. Which subscriber? As the list
grows, this question becomes more and more difficult to answer.

Sometimes a bounce message doesn't identify the address that failed.
On occasion it doesn't even include a copy of the original message.
See RFC 1211 for an extensive collection of horror stories.

[....]

Variable envelope return paths (VERPs) completely eliminate this
problem _right now_. They automatically and reliably identify the
subscription address relevant to each bounce message. They provide
the address in a form that is trivial for automated bounce handlers
to parse. They require support from the local mailer, but they do not
require support from any other hosts.


-Greg
Re: VERP [ In reply to ]
Excerpts from internet.computing.djb-qmailbeta: 6-Mar-97 VERP by Greg
Andrews@wco.com
> It's a new term in the qmail community. It's an acronym for
> "Variable Envelope Return Paths". It used to be called the
> "owner hack". It's what makes the envelope sender address on
> messages from the qmail list so long and complex.

Sounds good to me. How do I use VERPs? We at Monolith are maintaining more
and more public mailing lists and our ListMaster is about to drown in
bounce messages. If I can help him with his job a bit, he might not
quit on me.

We use Majordomo 1.94, btw.

Thanks


Aveek Datta _ _ _ _
_ __ ___ _ _ ___| (_) |_| |_ Network Admin, Monolith @ www.ml.org
_| ' \/ _ \ ' \/ _ \ | | _| ' \ _ SysAdmin, ITC @ www.itc.cmu.edu
(_)_|_|_\___/_||_\___/_|_|\__|_||_(_) Personal Homepage @ datta.ml.org
# All opinions are personal unless stated otherwise.
Re: VERP [ In reply to ]
Aveek Datta writes:

> Sounds good to me. How do I use VERPs?
> We use Majordomo 1.94, btw.

All you have to do to use VERP is given in the following command
(sorry to always be giving you shell scripts, but the Bourne shell
language is more precise than the English language). This creates the
.qmail-LIST-owner-default file which persuades qmail-alias to rewrite
the sender for each and every address it forwards to.

for i in .qmail-*-owner; do touch $i-default; done

But VERP is just part of the solution. You also need some software
that acts on the bounces. And (ta-da!) I have just the thing for you,
buckaroo. It's http://www.qmail.org/bounceman-0.4.shar. This
software monitors the list submissions and the bounces, and decides
who lives and who dies. All by its lonesome. You needn't ever see a
single bounce message again.

--
-russ <nelson@crynwr.com> http://www.crynwr.com/~nelson
Crynwr Software sells network driver support | PGP ok
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | Peace, Justice, Freedom:
Potsdam, NY 13676-3213 | +1 315 268 9201 FAX | pick two (only mostly true)
Re: VERP [ In reply to ]
Russell Nelson <nelson@crynwr.com> writes:
| .qmail-LIST-owner-default file which persuades qmail-alias to rewrite

It's kinda odd to request non-default behavior using something-default.
I think .qmail-LIST-owner-hack would be more veracious. :-)
Re: VERP [ In reply to ]
Hi,

I'm still not sure how to use it. I have a mailing list that uses
smartlist. Now let's just fix the part that it actually "sends" the mail
with VERP headers. If in ~list I have .qmail-mylist and
.qmail-mylist-request which contain | /home/list/.bin/flist mylist and
mylist-request respectively how do I tell it to fix outgoing headers? I
touch .~list/.qmail-mylist-owner and ~list/.qmail-mylist-owner-default or
does this only work with qlist?

Thanks,

Andi
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Andi Gutmans - Computer Science, Technion

Email: andi@il.eu.org andi@vipe.technion.ac.il
Web: http://andi.rifkin.technion.ac.il

PGP public key: finger andi@vipe.technion.ac.il
Re: VERP [ In reply to ]
Scott Schwartz:
> It's kinda odd to request non-default behavior using something-default.
> I think .qmail-LIST-owner-hack would be more veracious. :-)

Not at all -- you're changing the default behavior.

--
Raul