Mailing List Archive

Amazing! I hope I can help in this project and I guess that's a real way to
improve gentoo users' experience and to get involved lots of people in
gentoo (ubuntu learns that).

Cheers

Davide Italiano

On Mon, 03 Sep 2007 04:53:00 -0400
Luis Francisco Araujo <araujo@gentoo.org> wrote:

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> Hash: SHA1
>
> Hello,
>
> A group of our developers and i have felt the need of working around a
> new goal inside Gentoo: Graphical User Interfaces (GUI).
>
> Though Gentoo has been considered a very command line interface
> oriented system; we believe there is always room for new 'ways' of
> doing things in this distribution that helps our users to have a
> better Gentoo experience.
>
> Our main idea is to develop and collect all the necessary applications
> to offer GUI's (keeping Gentoo flexibility) for most of our system
> tasks, offering an alternative for those users who like these kind of
> interfaces.
>
> So we have started the Gentoo-GUI's project to work around the goal of
> making Gentoo more 'GUIzed' :-)
>
> Please visit the site http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/guis/ for further
> information. Note that we are just in the early stage of the project
> right now, but anybody is welcome to participate on what we currently
> have so far.

You should rename 'himerge' to YAPG (yet another portage GUI). Is there
a particular reason why you couldn't reuse one of the already
established ones (kuroo, porthole, portato, ...)?

Marius
--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

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Marius Mauch wrote:
>
> You should rename 'himerge' to YAPG (yet another portage GUI). Is there
> a particular reason why you couldn't reuse one of the already
> established ones (kuroo, porthole, portato, ...)?
>
> Marius

himerge is not really new ; it's been around for a good while now.

Its name stands for 'Haskell Interface for Emerge' ; plus i think some
of those GUI's you are mentioning didn't exist when i started himerge or
they don't offer all that himerge does.

Thanks and Regards,

- --

Luis F. Araujo "araujo at gentoo.org"
Gentoo Linux

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gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

On Monday 03 September 2007, Marius Mauch wrote:
> You should rename 'himerge' to YAPG (yet another portage GUI).

god no, please never let any Y* acronym soil Gentoo
-mike

what about A*? it's also a search algorithm you see.

On 9/3/07, Mike Frysinger <vapier@gentoo.org> wrote:
> On Monday 03 September 2007, Marius Mauch wrote:
> > You should rename 'himerge' to YAPG (yet another portage GUI).
>
> god no, please never let any Y* acronym soil Gentoo
> -mike
>
>
--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

On 04:53 Mon 03 Sep , Luis Francisco Araujo wrote:
> Our main idea is to develop and collect all the necessary applications
> to offer GUI's (keeping Gentoo flexibility) for most of our system
> tasks, offering an alternative for those users who like these kind of
> interfaces.

Please keep in mind all the GUI apps I added in
app-admin/system-config-* some time ago, so you don't need to duplicate
them.

Thanks,
Donnie
--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

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Donnie Berkholz wrote:
> On 04:53 Mon 03 Sep , Luis Francisco Araujo wrote:
>> Our main idea is to develop and collect all the necessary applications
>> to offer GUI's (keeping Gentoo flexibility) for most of our system
>> tasks, offering an alternative for those users who like these kind of
>> interfaces.
>
> Please keep in mind all the GUI apps I added in
> app-admin/system-config-* some time ago, so you don't need to duplicate
> them.
>
> Thanks,
> Donnie

Of course,

Thanks

- --

Luis F. Araujo "araujo at gentoo.org"
Gentoo Linux

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--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

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Jure Varlec wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I hope this post gets through, I just switched to using gmane, so I'm sorry
> if it gets posted incorrectly.
>
> I take it you intend to use GTK. May I suggest you also provide ncurses

Yes, we expect to use mainly either Gtk+ or Qt; though any toolkit
easily available on Gentoo would work too.

> interfaces to your programs? I'm not sure how much additional work that
> would be, as I don't program UIs. But an additional ncurses interface would
> provide users with the comfort of having the same tools available in case
> their Xorg fails for some reason, and on their X-less servers.
>

This project is focused on 'Graphical Interfaces' (hence its name);
therefore that's our main priority. Though a ncurse alternative could be
nice for some users, that would imply take other roads that we are not
willing to take, at least not yet. It could be possible in the future to
re-use part of our work for ncurses and terminal based interfaces , but
as i said, it is not our priority.

> Also, if a user modifies a tool-managed config file, the tool shouldn't get
> confused, and vice versa. I'm sure that goes without saying on Gentoo, but
> since I've only used GUI tools on Mandrake and Ubuntu and this is where
> they often fail, I feel the need to mention it. For example, Ubuntu's
> network config tool often didn't match what ifconfig said about the
> interfaces' status; I don't want to know what would happen to it if I used
> ifconfig to actually change configuration.
>

Designing a GUI involves many layers , and therefore, many ways of
communicating these layers .. it might sound an easy work, but in
practice it's tough to do it right.

One of this project's goals is to do it right on Gentoo systems.

Thanks and Regards,

- --

Luis F. Araujo "araujo at gentoo.org"
Gentoo Linux

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--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

From what I can tell the goal is to make GUIs to programs like equery,
rc-update, eclean, etc., right? Is there a formal design process here,
or could we all just take a stab at it?

Ciao,
bg

Markus Ullmann wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> I take it you intend to use GTK. May I suggest you also provide ncurses
>> interfaces to your programs? I'm not sure how much additional work that
>> would be, as I don't program UIs. But an additional ncurses interface
>> would provide users with the comfort of having the same tools available
>> in case their Xorg fails for some reason, and on their X-less servers.
>
> Erm, there is a big hint: patches welcome.
> Ncurses has the disadvantage of being a bit "underdocumented".
> So programming isn't that much fun, although when someone is willing to
> start, help will be there for sure :)
> Though we don't limit ourselves to one GUI. From what I've heard on IRC,
> nobody declined a request for other toolkit(s) if other people help with it.
>
> Greetz
> -Jokey
>
--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

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Hash: SHA1

Jure Varlec wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > I hope this post gets through, I just switched to using gmane, so
I'm sorry
> > if it gets posted incorrectly.
> >
> > I take it you intend to use GTK. May I suggest you also provide ncurses

Yes, we expect to use mainly either Gtk+ or Qt; though any toolkit
easily available on Gentoo would work too.

> > interfaces to your programs? I'm not sure how much additional work that
> > would be, as I don't program UIs. But an additional ncurses
interface would
> > provide users with the comfort of having the same tools available in
case
> > their Xorg fails for some reason, and on their X-less servers.
> >

This project is focused on 'Graphical Interfaces' (hence its name);
therefore that's our main priority. Though a ncurse alternative could be
nice for some users, that would imply take other roads that we are not
willing to take, at least not yet. It could be possible in the future to
re-use part of our work for ncurses and terminal based interfaces , but
as i said, it is not our priority.

> > Also, if a user modifies a tool-managed config file, the tool
shouldn't get
> > confused, and vice versa. I'm sure that goes without saying on
Gentoo, but
> > since I've only used GUI tools on Mandrake and Ubuntu and this is where
> > they often fail, I feel the need to mention it. For example, Ubuntu's
> > network config tool often didn't match what ifconfig said about the
> > interfaces' status; I don't want to know what would happen to it if
I used
> > ifconfig to actually change configuration.
> >

Designing a GUI involves many layers , and therefore, many ways of
communicating these layers .. it might sound an easy work, but in
practice it's tough to do it right.

One of this project's goals is to do it right on Gentoo systems.

Thanks and Regards,
- --

Luis F. Araujo "araujo at gentoo.org"
Gentoo Linux

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--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

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Hash: SHA1

Benjamin Gramlich wrote:
> From what I can tell the goal is to make GUIs to programs like equery,
> rc-update, eclean, etc., right? Is there a formal design process here,
> or could we all just take a stab at it?
>
> Ciao,
> bg
>

Yes, plus any other program that can benefit Gentoo systems (for example
to edit configuration files).

The project is just starting, so, i guess we will just keep stabbing for
now and getting a proper formal process on the way :-)

The best way to cooperate so far is subscribing to the gentoo-guis@l.g.o
list and joining us at #gentoo-guis in any case.

Thanks and Regards,

- --

Luis F. Araujo "araujo at gentoo.org"
Gentoo Linux

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gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

Luis Francisco Araujo wrote:

> himerge is not really new ; it's been around for a good while now.
>
> Its name stands for 'Haskell Interface for Emerge' ; plus i think some
> of those GUI's you are mentioning didn't exist when i started himerge or
> they don't offer all that himerge does.
>
http://www.haskell.org/himerge/himerge-screens/lasthimerge.png

Wow! Looks loverley.. /me logs onto #gentoo-haskell to bug araujo. ;P


--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Luis Francisco Araujo wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Hello,
>
> A group of our developers and i have felt the need of working around a
> new goal inside Gentoo: Graphical User Interfaces (GUI).
>
> Though Gentoo has been considered a very command line interface oriented
> system; we believe there is always room for new 'ways' of doing things
> in this distribution that helps our users to have a better Gentoo
> experience.
>
> Our main idea is to develop and collect all the necessary applications
> to offer GUI's (keeping Gentoo flexibility) for most of our system
> tasks, offering an alternative for those users who like these kind of
> interfaces.
>
> So we have started the Gentoo-GUI's project to work around the goal of
> making Gentoo more 'GUIzed' :-)
>
> Please visit the site http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/guis/ for further
> information. Note that we are just in the early stage of the project
> right now, but anybody is welcome to participate on what we currently
> have so far.
>
> Thanks and Regards,
>
> - --
>
> Luis F. Araujo "araujo at gentoo.org"
> Gentoo Linux
>
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> =+CBK
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Hello,

I hope this post gets through, I just switched to using gmane, so I'm sorry
if it gets posted incorrectly.

I take it you intend to use GTK. May I suggest you also provide ncurses
interfaces to your programs? I'm not sure how much additional work that
would be, as I don't program UIs. But an additional ncurses interface would
provide users with the comfort of having the same tools available in case
their Xorg fails for some reason, and on their X-less servers.

Also, if a user modifies a tool-managed config file, the tool shouldn't get
confused, and vice versa. I'm sure that goes without saying on Gentoo, but
since I've only used GUI tools on Mandrake and Ubuntu and this is where
they often fail, I feel the need to mention it. For example, Ubuntu's
network config tool often didn't match what ifconfig said about the
interfaces' status; I don't want to know what would happen to it if I used
ifconfig to actually change configuration.

Regards,
Jure

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--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

>Hello,
>
>I take it you intend to use GTK. May I suggest you also provide ncurses
>interfaces to your programs? I'm not sure how much additional work that
>would be, as I don't program UIs. But an additional ncurses interface
>would provide users with the comfort of having the same tools available
>in case their Xorg fails for some reason, and on their X-less servers.

Erm, there is a big hint: patches welcome.
Ncurses has the disadvantage of being a bit "underdocumented".
So programming isn't that much fun, although when someone is willing to
start, help will be there for sure :)
Though we don't limit ourselves to one GUI. From what I've heard on IRC,
nobody declined a request for other toolkit(s) if other people help with it.

Greetz
-Jokey