Hi,
Disclaimer**:
this mail is not meant to point the finger at someone, as I (thankfully)
don't know enough about who did what first to whom to do that; in fact,
I think no one does at this point.
Ciaran McCreesh schrieb:
> On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 23:31:56 +0000 (UTC) Hubert Mercier
> <anigel@gentoo.org> wrote:
>
>> In the last months, a some talented devs gone, and a few others were
>> thinking to do so. How much more before deciding to simplify our
>> organisation ?
>>
>
> Simplifying it won't help. If Gentoo wants more developers, it has to
> do three things:
>
> * Start delivering again. Not just shiny things, although some new shiny
> things would help, but also things that users and developers really
> need.
>
> * Substantially reduce user-visible breakages and breakages caused by
> carelessness or deliberate negligence that take huge amounts of time to
> fix.
>
> * Reduce the amount of arcane undocumented voodoo.
>
And, above all,
* stop to treat -dev (and the projects) as the ideal battleground for
personalities, the home of flames, the temple of mailwar.
You know what people state* as the major benefit from using Gentoo? It's
not portage, not the tree, certainly not stability or ease of use, it's
two things, the community and flexibility. In this order.
You all are a very visible part of that community.
> The only relevance of organisational issues is whether they help or
> hinder in achieving those objectives.
>
I'll use those words for my point, instead. The above list could be the
agenda of Microsoft, too (or Sun, IBM, ...); I don't want to say they're
unimportant, that would of course be wrong, but is *this* the core of
Gentoo? If you deliver, how you behave doesn't count? Scream all you
like, if you attach a patch? Hey, let's make each others life hell, as
long as we get releases out the door.
Will that work? I doubt it.
> PMS, in a round-about way, helps with all three.
Regards,
Thomas (who is just a user, until last week was pondering to help
out, until today advocated Gentoo, and who cares too much for it to stay
quiet, even if he doubts anyone will read this mail the way it was meant
to be)
* Yes, people I ask and people i know. No, I don't have a statistic at
hand. I can make one up if you want :-).
** Gentoo-Dev, where mails need a disclaimer, or someone *will* take it
personal.
--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Disclaimer**:
this mail is not meant to point the finger at someone, as I (thankfully)
don't know enough about who did what first to whom to do that; in fact,
I think no one does at this point.
Ciaran McCreesh schrieb:
> On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 23:31:56 +0000 (UTC) Hubert Mercier
> <anigel@gentoo.org> wrote:
>
>> In the last months, a some talented devs gone, and a few others were
>> thinking to do so. How much more before deciding to simplify our
>> organisation ?
>>
>
> Simplifying it won't help. If Gentoo wants more developers, it has to
> do three things:
>
> * Start delivering again. Not just shiny things, although some new shiny
> things would help, but also things that users and developers really
> need.
>
> * Substantially reduce user-visible breakages and breakages caused by
> carelessness or deliberate negligence that take huge amounts of time to
> fix.
>
> * Reduce the amount of arcane undocumented voodoo.
>
And, above all,
* stop to treat -dev (and the projects) as the ideal battleground for
personalities, the home of flames, the temple of mailwar.
You know what people state* as the major benefit from using Gentoo? It's
not portage, not the tree, certainly not stability or ease of use, it's
two things, the community and flexibility. In this order.
You all are a very visible part of that community.
> The only relevance of organisational issues is whether they help or
> hinder in achieving those objectives.
>
I'll use those words for my point, instead. The above list could be the
agenda of Microsoft, too (or Sun, IBM, ...); I don't want to say they're
unimportant, that would of course be wrong, but is *this* the core of
Gentoo? If you deliver, how you behave doesn't count? Scream all you
like, if you attach a patch? Hey, let's make each others life hell, as
long as we get releases out the door.
Will that work? I doubt it.
> PMS, in a round-about way, helps with all three.
Regards,
Thomas (who is just a user, until last week was pondering to help
out, until today advocated Gentoo, and who cares too much for it to stay
quiet, even if he doubts anyone will read this mail the way it was meant
to be)
* Yes, people I ask and people i know. No, I don't have a statistic at
hand. I can make one up if you want :-).
** Gentoo-Dev, where mails need a disclaimer, or someone *will* take it
personal.
--
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list