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Hi Aran,
did you look at Plack::Session if you want something decoupled from Catalyst?
I haven't used it so far as I don't require sessions that are shared with non-Catalyst stuff but it might be a better base for a futureproof session module.

On 2015-07-09 02:17, Aran Deltac wrote:
Hey guys,

I've been working on a project which is a (mostly) drop in replacement for Catalyst::Plugin::Session. Here are the GitHub repos:

https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch
https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Store-CHI
https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Store-AmazonDynamoDB
https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Plugin-Sereal
https://github.com/bluefeet/Catalyst-Plugin-Starch

The manual is a good place to start:

https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch/blob/master/lib/Web/Starch/Manual.pod

I'm using this @work and will be deploying it to production, replacing Catalyst::Plugin::Session, sometime next week if all goes well this week.

I've not put these modules on CPAN yet as I'd love some feedback before I do so. I want to make sure the module names, the interfaces, and just the entire design are acceptable to people. I want this to be a real step forward.

@work we've made extensive use of Catalyst::Plugin::Sesssion for years now, and related modules such as Catalyst::Plugin::Authentication. So far everything has "just worked" when I replaced Catalyst::Plugin::Session with Catalyst::Plugin::Starch.

Why do this?

* Catalyst::Plugin::Session (C:P:S) is slower in NYTProf reports than I would expect it to be.
* C:P:S is tied into Catalyst. This is unnecessary. Catalyst should be used to glue things together, not as a platform to build whole technologies on. By decoupling sessions from Catalyst many wins can be had in reusability and unit testing (etc?).
* C:P:S can be difficult and messy to extend. This is partly due to how Catalyst plugins work, but also due to the design of C:P:S.

Aran



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Ya, I have Plack::Middleware::Session listed in the alternatives section of
the manual. Thanks for the reply!

On Thu, Jul 9, 2015 at 7:14 AM Hartmaier Alexander <
alexander.hartmaier@t-systems.at> wrote:

> Hi Aran,
> did you look at Plack::Session if you want something decoupled from
> Catalyst?
> I haven't used it so far as I don't require sessions that are shared with
> non-Catalyst stuff but it might be a better base for a futureproof session
> module.
>
> On 2015-07-09 02:17, Aran Deltac wrote:
>
> Hey guys,
>
> I've been working on a project which is a (mostly) drop in replacement
> for Catalyst::Plugin::Session. Here are the GitHub repos:
>
> https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch
> https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Store-CHI
> https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Store-AmazonDynamoDB
> https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Plugin-Sereal
> https://github.com/bluefeet/Catalyst-Plugin-Starch
>
> The manual is a good place to start:
>
>
> https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch/blob/master/lib/Web/Starch/Manual.pod
>
> I'm using this @work and will be deploying it to production, replacing
> Catalyst::Plugin::Session, sometime next week if all goes well this week.
>
> I've not put these modules on CPAN yet as I'd love some feedback before
> I do so. I want to make sure the module names, the interfaces, and just
> the entire design are acceptable to people. I want this to be a real step
> forward.
>
> @work we've made extensive use of Catalyst::Plugin::Sesssion for years
> now, and related modules such as Catalyst::Plugin::Authentication. So far
> everything has "just worked" when I replaced Catalyst::Plugin::Session with
> Catalyst::Plugin::Starch.
>
> Why do this?
>
> - Catalyst::Plugin::Session (C:P:S) is slower in NYTProf reports than
> I would expect it to be.
> - C:P:S is tied into Catalyst. This is unnecessary. Catalyst should
> be used to glue things together, not as a platform to build whole
> technologies on. By decoupling sessions from Catalyst many wins can be had
> in reusability and unit testing (etc?).
> - C:P:S can be difficult and messy to extend. This is partly due to
> how Catalyst plugins work, but also due to the design of C:P:S.
>
> Aran
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk
> Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
> Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/
> Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
>
>
>
>
>
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> T-Systems Austria GesmbH Rennweg 97-99, 1030 Wien
> Handelsgericht Wien, FN 79340b
>
> *"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*"*
> Notice: This e-mail contains information that is confidential and may be
> privileged.
> If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then
> delete this e-mail immediately.
>
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> _______________________________________________
> List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk
> Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
> Searchable archive:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/
> Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
>

I would think that this could be used by Plack middleware and Catalyst as core session functionality.  So I don't think in the end its either or.
Aran, the main thing I can't figure is how to have a cookie storage... since that's gotta be aware of the request/response cycle.  I'd adopt this in a moment for new code if we could figure that part out.  Personally I just put a few tiny IDs in the session so cookie storage is more than enough, and nice for quick prototypes.
Any thoughts?  You can hit me out on IRC #catalyst if that is either - jnap


On Thursday, July 9, 2015 10:35 AM, Aran Deltac <bluefeet@gmail.com> wrote:


Ya, I have Plack::Middleware::Session listed in the alternatives section of the manual.  Thanks for the reply!

On Thu, Jul 9, 2015 at 7:14 AM Hartmaier Alexander <alexander.hartmaier@t-systems.at> wrote:

Hi Aran,
did you look at Plack::Session if you want something decoupled from Catalyst?
I haven't used it so far as I don't require sessions that are shared with non-Catalyst stuff but it might be a better base for a futureproof session module.

On 2015-07-09 02:17, Aran Deltac wrote:

Hey guys,
I've been working on a project which is a (mostly) drop in replacement for Catalyst::Plugin::Session.  Here are the GitHub repos:
https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starchhttps://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Store-CHIhttps://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Store-AmazonDynamoDBhttps://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Plugin-Serealhttps://github.com/bluefeet/Catalyst-Plugin-Starch
The manual is a good place to start:
https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch/blob/master/lib/Web/Starch/Manual.pod

I'm using this @work and will be deploying it to production, replacing Catalyst::Plugin::Session, sometime next week if all goes well this week.
I've not put these modules on CPAN yet as I'd love some feedback before I do so.  I want to make sure the module names, the interfaces, and just the entire design are acceptable to people.  I want this to be a real step forward.
@work we've made extensive use of Catalyst::Plugin::Sesssion for years now, and related modules such as Catalyst::Plugin::Authentication.  So far everything has "just worked" when I replaced Catalyst::Plugin::Session with Catalyst::Plugin::Starch.
Why do this?
- Catalyst::Plugin::Session (C:P:S) is slower in NYTProf reports than I would expect it to be.
- C:P:S is tied into Catalyst.  This is unnecessary.  Catalyst should be used to glue things together, not as a platform to build whole technologies on.  By decoupling sessions from Catalyst many wins can be had in reusability and unit testing (etc?).
- C:P:S can be difficult and messy to extend.  This is partly due to how Catalyst plugins work, but also due to the design of C:P:S.
Aran




_______________________________________________
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FWIW I had to add a bit to the Catalyst session stuff to enable that store in cookie thing, here's the diff:
Search the CPAN - metacpan.org

|   |
|   |   |   |   |   |
| Search the CPAN - metacpan.orgChanges05 META.yml88 inc/Module/Install/Base.pm11 inc/Module/Install/Can.pm11 inc/Module/Install/Fetch.pm11 inc/Module/Install/Makefile.pm22 inc/Module/Install/Metadata.pm33 |
| |
| View on metacpan.org | Preview by Yahoo |
| |
|   |


Might just need a simple change on the catalyst adaptor.  


On Thursday, July 9, 2015 2:29 PM, John Napiorkowski <jjn1056@yahoo.com> wrote:


I would think that this could be used by Plack middleware and Catalyst as core session functionality.  So I don't think in the end its either or.
Aran, the main thing I can't figure is how to have a cookie storage... since that's gotta be aware of the request/response cycle.  I'd adopt this in a moment for new code if we could figure that part out.  Personally I just put a few tiny IDs in the session so cookie storage is more than enough, and nice for quick prototypes.
Any thoughts?  You can hit me out on IRC #catalyst if that is either - jnap


On Thursday, July 9, 2015 10:35 AM, Aran Deltac <bluefeet@gmail.com> wrote:


Ya, I have Plack::Middleware::Session listed in the alternatives section of the manual.  Thanks for the reply!

On Thu, Jul 9, 2015 at 7:14 AM Hartmaier Alexander <alexander.hartmaier@t-systems.at> wrote:

Hi Aran,
did you look at Plack::Session if you want something decoupled from Catalyst?
I haven't used it so far as I don't require sessions that are shared with non-Catalyst stuff but it might be a better base for a futureproof session module.

On 2015-07-09 02:17, Aran Deltac wrote:

Hey guys,
I've been working on a project which is a (mostly) drop in replacement for Catalyst::Plugin::Session.  Here are the GitHub repos:
https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starchhttps://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Store-CHIhttps://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Store-AmazonDynamoDBhttps://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch-Plugin-Serealhttps://github.com/bluefeet/Catalyst-Plugin-Starch
The manual is a good place to start:
https://github.com/bluefeet/Web-Starch/blob/master/lib/Web/Starch/Manual.pod

I'm using this @work and will be deploying it to production, replacing Catalyst::Plugin::Session, sometime next week if all goes well this week.
I've not put these modules on CPAN yet as I'd love some feedback before I do so.  I want to make sure the module names, the interfaces, and just the entire design are acceptable to people.  I want this to be a real step forward.
@work we've made extensive use of Catalyst::Plugin::Sesssion for years now, and related modules such as Catalyst::Plugin::Authentication.  So far everything has "just worked" when I replaced Catalyst::Plugin::Session with Catalyst::Plugin::Starch.
Why do this?
- Catalyst::Plugin::Session (C:P:S) is slower in NYTProf reports than I would expect it to be.
- C:P:S is tied into Catalyst.  This is unnecessary.  Catalyst should be used to glue things together, not as a platform to build whole technologies on.  By decoupling sessions from Catalyst many wins can be had in reusability and unit testing (etc?).
- C:P:S can be difficult and messy to extend.  This is partly due to how Catalyst plugins work, but also due to the design of C:P:S.
Aran




_______________________________________________
List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk
Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/
Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/




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T-Systems Austria GesmbH Rennweg 97-99, 1030 Wien
Handelsgericht Wien, FN 79340b
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Notice: This e-mail contains information that is confidential and may be privileged.
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