Mailing List Archive

Hi

On Thu, Aug 19, 2004 at 04:25:28PM -0700, Zach wrote:
> Where are the archives for this list? 
> -------
> Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
> Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
> To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
> please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com


> Not to mention wouldn't a forum be better suited for this type of thing?  Anyway - I have a lot of domain names, that send email out.  I am a little lost on how exactly I set this up.

Forums suck, they have to be checked specifically through a web browser, this stuff ends up in my mail box so i can't avoid it :) Anyway, if you use a decent MUA it should just display the threads in the same tree-like structure as a forum would.

> Just want to get this set up - so any suggestions would be cool - I have spent the last year and a half just avoiding my email box - and this is the most promising looking thing I have seen to stop spam or at least make it so I can put in filters that work.

I think it's pretty straightforward. Think about what SPF is supposed to do: it publishes for a domain which hosts are allowed to send out mail for that domain. So, if you have a series of domains, x.tld, y.tld, z.tld and they all send out mail from the server with ip 1.2.3.4, publish something like "v=spf1 ip4:1.2.3.4 -all"..

If the domains all have the A record 1.2.3.4, "v=spf1 a -all" would also suffice. If the incoming (MX in dns) and outgoing mail servers are the same for each domain "v=spf1 mx -all" would suffice. But you have to put an spf record for each domain. You can also put "v=spf1 ip4:1.2.3.4 -all" only on x.tld, and put "v=spf1 redirect:x.tld" on y.tld and z.tld, this way you only have to manage one spf record for all your domains.

If you want to know what you are doing, please please please RTFM, it's on spf.pobox.com, most specifically:

http://spf.pobox.com/mechanisms.html

http://spf.pobox.com/rfcs.html

http://spf.pobox.com/faq.html

Koen

--
K.F.J. Martens, Sonologic, http://www.sonologic.nl/
Networking, embedded systems, unix expertise, artificial intelligence.
Public PGP key: http://www.metro.cx/pubkey-gmc.asc
Wondering about the funny attachment your mail program
can't read? Visit http://www.openpgp.org/

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

Hi

On Thu, Aug 19, 2004 at 04:25:28PM -0700, Zach wrote:
> Where are the archives for this list? 
> -------
> Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
> Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
> To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
> please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com


> Not to mention wouldn't a forum be better suited for this type of thing?  Anyway - I have a lot of domain names, that send email out.  I am a little lost on how exactly I set this up.

Forums suck, they have to be checked specifically through a web browser, this stuff ends up in my mail box so i can't avoid it :) Anyway, if you use a decent MUA it should just display the threads in the same tree-like structure as a forum would.

> Just want to get this set up - so any suggestions would be cool - I have spent the last year and a half just avoiding my email box - and this is the most promising looking thing I have seen to stop spam or at least make it so I can put in filters that work.

I think it's pretty straightforward. Think about what SPF is supposed to do: it publishes for a domain which hosts are allowed to send out mail for that domain. So, if you have a series of domains, x.tld, y.tld, z.tld and they all send out mail from the server with ip 1.2.3.4, publish something like "v=spf1 ip4:1.2.3.4 -all"..

If the domains all have the A record 1.2.3.4, "v=spf1 a -all" would also suffice. If the incoming (MX in dns) and outgoing mail servers are the same for each domain "v=spf1 mx -all" would suffice. But you have to put an spf record for each domain. You can also put "v=spf1 ip4:1.2.3.4 -all" only on x.tld, and put "v=spf1 redirect:x.tld" on y.tld and z.tld, this way you only have to manage one spf record for all your domains.

If you want to know what you are doing, please please please RTFM, it's on spf.pobox.com, most specifically:

http://spf.pobox.com/mechanisms.html

http://spf.pobox.com/rfcs.html

http://spf.pobox.com/faq.html

Koen

--
K.F.J. Martens, Sonologic, http://www.sonologic.nl/
Networking, embedded systems, unix expertise, artificial intelligence.
Public PGP key: http://www.metro.cx/pubkey-gmc.asc
Wondering about the funny attachment your mail program
can't read? Visit http://www.openpgp.org/

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

Oh,

I completely forgot:

- in relation to spam: spf does not stop spam. if you want to stop spam, there's a pletora of methods: reject mail that helo's as your own server, use dnsbl's, ...

spf helps rejecting forgeries from domains that publish spf, and you need to have some form of spf into your mta for that.. look at the 'downloads' page of spf.pobox.com or check out www.libspf2.org and/or www.libspf.org..

Koen

On Thu, Aug 19, 2004 at 04:25:28PM -0700, Zach wrote:
> Where are the archives for this list? 
>  
> Not to mention wouldn't a forum be better suited for this type of thing?  Anyway - I have a lot of domain names, that send email out.  I am a little lost on how exactly I set this up.
>  
> The all go out through the same machine, so would I put them all under that machine name as the sender?  Or what, little confused (and all the domains are in together - meaning that I pesonally would receive a Zach@efsw.com email and a Zach@Sportsforum.ws email as if they where the same address. 
>  
> I also can send an email from efsw.com with a reply of to of sportsforum.ws, or send an email from sportsforum.ws with a reply to of efsw.com  - (multiply that by about 200 domains)
>  
> Just want to get this set up - so any suggestions would be cool - I have spent the last year and a half just avoiding my email box - and this is the most promising looking thing I have seen to stop spam or at least make it so I can put in filters that work.
>  
> Zach
>  
> (oh I only actually respond to email at zach@anotherdomain.name, just fyi that those email addresses above  just go into a garbage bag.
>
> -------
> Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
> Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
> To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
> please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

--
K.F.J. Martens, Sonologic, http://www.sonologic.nl/
Networking, embedded systems, unix expertise, artificial intelligence.
Public PGP key: http://www.metro.cx/pubkey-gmc.asc
Wondering about the funny attachment your mail program
can't read? Visit http://www.openpgp.org/

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

> Forums suck, they have to be checked specifically through a web browser,
> this stuff ends up in my mail box so i can't avoid it :) Anyway, if you
> use a decent MUA it should just display the threads in the same tree-like
> structure as a forum would.

Mailing lists suck. They fill up my mailbox, I have to be able to get at my
email in order to read them, they're much less intuitive, harder to navigate
or find stuff in, and the web-based archives are a pain to wade through.

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

> Forums suck, they have to be checked specifically through a web browser,
> this stuff ends up in my mail box so i can't avoid it :) Anyway, if you
> use a decent MUA it should just display the threads in the same tree-like
> structure as a forum would.

Mailing lists suck. They fill up my mailbox, I have to be able to get at my
email in order to read them, they're much less intuitive, harder to navigate
or find stuff in, and the web-based archives are a pain to wade through.

Plus I keep sending messages to them from the wrong email account, which
annoys the moderators...




-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

You can set filters to parse the various list messages into their
ownfolders.

CF
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Smith" <spf@ms.cx>
To: <spf-help@v2.listbox.com>
Sent: Friday, August 20, 2004 8:09 AM
Subject: RE: [spf-help] Newbie here


> > Forums suck, they have to be checked specifically through a web browser,
> > this stuff ends up in my mail box so i can't avoid it :) Anyway, if you
> > use a decent MUA it should just display the threads in the same
tree-like
> > structure as a forum would.
>
> Mailing lists suck. They fill up my mailbox, I have to be able to get at
my
> email in order to read them, they're much less intuitive, harder to
navigate
> or find stuff in, and the web-based archives are a pain to wade through.
>
> Plus I keep sending messages to them from the wrong email account, which
> annoys the moderators...
>
>
>
>
> -------
> Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
> Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
> To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your
subscription,
> please go to
http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com
>


-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

On Fri, Aug 20, 2004 at 02:09:33PM +0100, Mark Smith wrote:
> > Forums suck, they have to be checked specifically through a web browser,
> > this stuff ends up in my mail box so i can't avoid it :) Anyway, if you
> > use a decent MUA it should just display the threads in the same tree-like
> > structure as a forum would.
>
> Mailing lists suck. They fill up my mailbox, I have to be able to get at my
> email in order to read them, they're much less intuitive, harder to navigate
> or find stuff in, and the web-based archives are a pain to wade through.
>
> Plus I keep sending messages to them from the wrong email account, which
> annoys the moderators...

Grin, I guess it's a matter of taste, right :)

I'd like to continue the discussion of this (in fact, i just spoke with a couple of new media experts about this and we all agreed forums are not a good tool).

All i know is that the things you describe i can do perfectly well with my mail client, and not with most of the forum software i've seen on the net.

Koen

--
K.F.J. Martens, Sonologic, http://www.sonologic.nl/
Networking, embedded systems, unix expertise, artificial intelligence.
Public PGP key: http://www.metro.cx/pubkey-gmc.asc
Wondering about the funny attachment your mail program
can't read? Visit http://www.openpgp.org/

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

Forums suck - I use a gprs connection and I have to pay for my bandwidth by
the Kb, so all those crappy forum pages are useless to me - I have opted out
of all of them - and twiki, and other similar crappy systems. ( Yes the
spamassassin website sucks too ). Any website that is all images is useless
to me - all those stupid button links made from images with no "alt" text to
tell me what they do - all utter garbage. I've written more than one flamer
to website designers/hosts on this topic ;-)

I can receive plain old e-mails easily, they aren't too heavy on bandwidth
(though I wish people would snip more when replying) and I can filter, sort,
analyse, search and browse the whole lot offline :-)

In my opinion *everyone* should have to use this bandwidth payment format -
by the Kb - It would cut down the amount of garbage on the internet, and
*really* encourage people to sort out their anti-spam situation. Thereby
making the spammers also sort themselves out. Yes - there *are* people who
read their porn mail - and even reply to it! We can *not* judge what is
spam and what is not - it is entirely in the eye of the recipient.


Slainte,

JohnP.
johnp@idimo.com
ICQ 313355492


----- Original Message -----
From: "Koen Martens" <spf@metro.cx>
To: <spf-help@v2.listbox.com>
Sent: Friday, August 20, 2004 4:35 PM
Subject: Re: [spf-help] Newbie here


> On Fri, Aug 20, 2004 at 02:09:33PM +0100, Mark Smith wrote:
> > > Forums suck, they have to be checked specifically through a web
browser,
> > > this stuff ends up in my mail box so i can't avoid it :) Anyway, if
you
> > > use a decent MUA it should just display the threads in the same
tree-like
> > > structure as a forum would.
> >
> > Mailing lists suck. They fill up my mailbox, I have to be able to get at
my
> > email in order to read them, they're much less intuitive, harder to
navigate
> > or find stuff in, and the web-based archives are a pain to wade through.
> >
> > Plus I keep sending messages to them from the wrong email account, which
> > annoys the moderators...
>
> Grin, I guess it's a matter of taste, right :)
>
> I'd like to continue the discussion of this (in fact, i just spoke with a
couple of new media experts about this and we all agreed forums are not a
good tool).
>
> All i know is that the things you describe i can do perfectly well with my
mail client, and not with most of the forum software i've seen on the net.
>
> Koen
>
> --
> K.F.J. Martens, Sonologic, http://www.sonologic.nl/
> Networking, embedded systems, unix expertise, artificial intelligence.
> Public PGP key: http://www.metro.cx/pubkey-gmc.asc
> Wondering about the funny attachment your mail program
> can't read? Visit http://www.openpgp.org/
>
> -------
> Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
> Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
> To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your
subscription,
> please go to
http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

This is what I get when I set my PHP-form mail function headers to respond
with an address that isn't going to annoy sysadmins. How can I make this
compatible with spf?

X-Authentication-Warning: miranda.server-plant.co.uk: apache set sender to
elcamachowebsite@idimo.com using -f


Slainte,

JohnP.
johnp@idimo.com
ICQ 313355492

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

Hmmm,

So what is exactly the problem? I don't think an
X-Authentication-Warning is incompatible with spf, since it will only
look at HELO FROM and sometimes HELO.

Anyway, you can avoid the header by adding apache to your 'trusted
users' group in sendmail, either by editting sendmail.cf (not
recommended) and adding the user to the T class, like so:

Troot apache

Or by regenerating your sendmail.cf from your mc (recommended) file with
this line added:

FEATURE(`use_ct_file')

You will then be able to put a list of trusted users in
/etc/mail/trusted-users.

Note that a trusted user is a user who may set -f without a
X-Authentication-Warning header being added _and_ who may regenerate the
alias database.

Koen

On Sat, Aug 21, 2004 at 12:31:26PM +0200, jpinkerton wrote:
> This is what I get when I set my PHP-form mail function headers to respond
> with an address that isn't going to annoy sysadmins. How can I make this
> compatible with spf?
>
> X-Authentication-Warning: miranda.server-plant.co.uk: apache set sender to
> elcamachowebsite@idimo.com using -f
>
>
> Slainte,
>
> JohnP.
> johnp@idimo.com
> ICQ 313355492
>
> -------
> Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
> Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
> To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
> please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

--
K.F.J. Martens, Sonologic, http://www.sonologic.nl/
Networking, embedded systems, unix expertise, artificial intelligence.
Public PGP key: http://www.metro.cx/pubkey-gmc.asc
Wondering about the funny attachment your mail program
can't read? Visit http://www.openpgp.org/

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

From: "Koen Martens" <spf@metro.cx>

> Anyway, you can avoid the header by adding apache to your 'trusted
> users' group in sendmail, either by editting sendmail.cf (not
> recommended) and adding the user to the T class, like so:
>
> Troot apache
>
> Or by regenerating your sendmail.cf from your mc (recommended) file with
> this line added:
>
> FEATURE(`use_ct_file')
>
> You will then be able to put a list of trusted users in
> /etc/mail/trusted-users.
>
> Note that a trusted user is a user who may set -f without a
> X-Authentication-Warning header being added _and_ who may regenerate the
> alias database.

Ah-ha !! That's exactly what's needed - many thanks Koen :-)


Slainte,

JohnP.
johnp@idimo.com
ICQ 313355492

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

Unless I am missing something, its going to reject foreries as you said. 

Well I hate the spam blockers out there, I am sure there is a couple good desktop ones, but I have watched them practically run my servers into the ground server side - and I personally use only webmail because I never know where I might have to access it.
 
What that does as far as I am concerned is allow me to reject any email that comes from a server that is not registered, along with the forgeries.  Yes, I understand that doesnt mean that spam will not come from registered servers - but that is as easy as pie to block that with just some filters in the mail software.
 
As far as the good emails from non registered servers, my response is - So, not my problem.
 
Zach
 
 
 
_________________________________
Oh,

I completely forgot:

- in relation to spam: spf does not stop spam. if you want to stop spam, there's a pletora of methods: reject mail that helo's as your own server, use dnsbl's, ...

spf helps rejecting forgeries from domains that publish spf, and you need to have some form of spf into your mta for that.. look at the 'downloads' page of spf.pobox.com or check out www.libspf2.org and/or www.libspf.org..

Koen
 
 
____________________________

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

Can someone help me iam a newbie and I don't know what the heck is going on with this SPF stuff, forgery, etc...
I just want to setup my mx records or what should I setup MX or TXT? I want something simple.
Iam running exchange only for my email purpose and no one else, very simple email server using exchange.
Where and how, thanks

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-spf-help@v2.listbox.com [mailto:owner-spf-help@v2.listbox.com] On Behalf Of Zach
Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2004 11:07 AM
To: spf-help@v2.listbox.com
Subject: Re: [spf-help] Newbie here

Unless I am missing something, its going to reject foreries as you said. 

Well I hate the spam blockers out there, I am sure there is a couple good desktop ones, but I have watched them practically run my servers into the ground server side - and I personally use only webmail because I never know where I might have to access it.
 
What that does as far as I am concerned is allow me to reject any email that comes from a server that is not registered, along with the forgeries.  Yes, I understand that doesnt mean that spam will not come from registered servers - but that is as easy as pie to block that with just some filters in the mail software.
 
As far as the good emails from non registered servers, my response is - So, not my problem.
 
Zach
 
 
 
_________________________________
Oh,

I completely forgot:

- in relation to spam: spf does not stop spam. if you want to stop spam, there's a pletora of methods: reject mail that helo's as your own server, use dnsbl's, ...

spf helps rejecting forgeries from domains that publish spf, and you need to have some form of spf into your mta for that.. look at the 'downloads' page of spf.pobox.com or check out www.libspf2.org and/or www.libspf.org..

Koen
 
 
____________________________

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription, please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

I think the SPF will go along way and should be easier then RDNS lookups which a lot of spam programs use now which creates a lot of overhead. Right now our anti spam software works very well for us but its still taking up bandwidth and cpu to process/manage. The SPF will help cut that cost down considerably (I think)

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-spf-help@v2.listbox.com [mailto:owner-spf-help@v2.listbox.com] On Behalf Of Zach
Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2004 9:07 PM
To: spf-help@v2.listbox.com
Subject: Re: [spf-help] Newbie here

Unless I am missing something, its going to reject foreries as you said. 

Well I hate the spam blockers out there, I am sure there is a couple good desktop ones, but I have watched them practically run my servers into the ground server side - and I personally use only webmail because I never know where I might have to access it.
 
What that does as far as I am concerned is allow me to reject any email that comes from a server that is not registered, along with the forgeries.  Yes, I understand that doesnt mean that spam will not come from registered servers - but that is as easy as pie to block that with just some filters in the mail software.
 
As far as the good emails from non registered servers, my response is - So, not my problem.
 
Zach
 
 
 
_________________________________
Oh,

I completely forgot:

- in relation to spam: spf does not stop spam. if you want to stop spam, there's a pletora of methods: reject mail that helo's as your own server, use dnsbl's, ...

spf helps rejecting forgeries from domains that publish spf, and you need to have some form of spf into your mta for that.. look at the 'downloads' page of spf.pobox.com or check out www.libspf2.org and/or www.libspf.org..

Koen
 
 
____________________________

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription, please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This email is intended only for the named recipents. All email is monitored and archived for compliance requirements.
The views or context in this message may not reflect the view or context of the company.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com

Bennyc said:
> Can someone help me iam a newbie and I don't know what the heck is going
> on with this SPF stuff, forgery, etc...
> I just want to setup my mx records or what should I setup MX or TXT? I
> want something simple.
> Iam running exchange only for my email purpose and no one else, very
> simple email server using exchange.
> Where and how, thanks
>

I think we understood your question the first time you asked. No need for
the multiple posts. And please don't respond to someone else's thread
when posting a new question.

For hafaguam.com, you already have everything necessary to run your mail
service as should be apparent since you are receiving mail by now. Adding
an spf record isn't a necessary step.

If you still want one, use the wizard at http://spf.pobox.com. Take the
output and create your text record. If you want to evaluate spf records
on your server, you will need one of the plugins. Look at
http://spf.pobox.com/downloads.html#windows.

-------
Archives at http://archives.listbox.com/spf-help/current/
Donate! http://spf.pobox.com/donations.html
To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription,
please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=spf-help@v2.listbox.com