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Re: [Openstack-sigs] [openstack-dev] Open letter/request to TC candidates (and existing elected officials)
On 2018-09-12 16:03:12 -0600 (-0600), Zhipeng Huang wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 3:55 PM Jeremy Stanley <fungi@yuggoth.org> wrote:
> > On 2018-09-12 09:47:27 -0600 (-0600), Matt Riedemann wrote:
> > [...]
> > > So I encourage all elected TC members to work directly with the
> > > various SIGs to figure out their top issue and then work on
> > > managing those deliverables across the community because the TC is
> > > particularly well suited to do so given the elected position.
> > [...]
> >
> > I almost agree with you. I think the OpenStack TC members should be
> > actively engaged in recruiting and enabling interested people in the
> > community to do those things, but I don't think such work should be
> > solely the domain of the TC and would hate to give the impression
> > that you must be on the TC to have such an impact.
>
> Jeremy, this is not to say that one must be on the TC to have such an
> impact, it is that TC has the duty more than anyone else to get this
> specific cross-project goal done. I would even argue it is not the job
> description of TC to enable/recruit, but to just do it.

I think Doug's work leading the Python 3 First effort is a great
example. He has helped find and enable several other goal champions
to collaborate on this. I appreciate the variety of other things
Doug already does with his available time and would rather he not
stop doing those things to spend all his time acting as a project
manager.
--
Jeremy Stanley
Re: [Openstack-sigs] [openstack-dev] Open letter/request to TC candidates (and existing elected officials) [ In reply to ]
On 9/12/2018 4:14 PM, Jeremy Stanley wrote:
> I think Doug's work leading the Python 3 First effort is a great
> example. He has helped find and enable several other goal champions
> to collaborate on this. I appreciate the variety of other things
> Doug already does with his available time and would rather he not
> stop doing those things to spend all his time acting as a project
> manager.

I specifically called out what Doug is doing as an example of things I
want to see the TC doing. I want more/all TC members doing that.

--

Thanks,

Matt

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Re: [Openstack-sigs] [openstack-dev] Open letter/request to TC candidates (and existing elected officials) [ In reply to ]
On 2018-09-12 17:03:10 -0600 (-0600), Matt Riedemann wrote:
> On 9/12/2018 4:14 PM, Jeremy Stanley wrote:
> > I think Doug's work leading the Python 3 First effort is a great
> > example. He has helped find and enable several other goal champions
> > to collaborate on this. I appreciate the variety of other things
> > Doug already does with his available time and would rather he not
> > stop doing those things to spend all his time acting as a project
> > manager.
>
> I specifically called out what Doug is doing as an example of
> things I want to see the TC doing. I want more/all TC members
> doing that.

With that I was replying to Zhipeng Huang's message which you have
trimmed above, specifically countering the assertion that recruiting
others to help with these efforts is a waste of time and that TC
members should simply do all the work themselves instead.
--
Jeremy Stanley
Re: [Openstack-sigs] [openstack-dev] Open letter/request to TC candidates (and existing elected officials) [ In reply to ]
On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 10:15 AM Fox, Kevin M <Kevin.Fox@pnnl.gov> wrote:

> How about stated this way,
> Its the tc's responsibility to get it done. Either by delegating the
> activity, or by doing it themselves. But either way, it needs to get done.
> Its a ball that has been dropped too much in OpenStacks history. If no one
> is ultimately responsible, balls will keep getting dropped.
>
> Thanks,
> Kevin
>

+1 Kevin
--
Zhipeng (Howard) Huang

Standard Engineer
IT Standard & Patent/IT Product Line
Huawei Technologies Co,. Ltd
Email: huangzhipeng@huawei.com
Office: Huawei Industrial Base, Longgang, Shenzhen

(Previous)
Research Assistant
Mobile Ad-Hoc Network Lab, Calit2
University of California, Irvine
Email: zhipengh@uci.edu
Office: Calit2 Building Room 2402

OpenStack, OPNFV, OpenDaylight, OpenCompute Aficionado
Re: [Openstack-sigs] [openstack-dev] Open letter/request to TC candidates (and existing elected officials) [ In reply to ]
On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 9:14 AM, Fox, Kevin M <Kevin.Fox@pnnl.gov> wrote:
> How about stated this way,
> Its the tc's responsibility to get it done. Either by delegating the activity, or by doing it themselves. But either way, it needs to get done. Its a ball that has been dropped too much in OpenStacks history. If no one is ultimately responsible, balls will keep getting dropped.
>
> Thanks,
> Kevin

I see the role of TC the same way I do the PTL hat, but on more of a
meta scale: too much direct involvement can stifle things. On the
inverse, not enough involvement can result in people saying one's work
is legacy, to be nice, or dead, at worst.

All too often, we humans get hung up on the definitions of words,
sometimes to the point of inaction. It seems only when someone says
sod it do things move forward, regardless of anyone's level of
involvement.

I look to TC as the group that sets the tone, de facto product owners,
to paraphrase from OpenStack's native tongue. The more hands-on an
individual is with the output, TC or not, a perception arises that a
given effort needs only that person's attention; thereby, setting a
much different narrative than might otherwise be immediately noticed
or desired.

The place I see TC is making sure that there is meaningful progress on
agreed-upon efforts, however that needs to exist. Sometimes that might
be recruiting, but I don't see browbeating social media to be
particularly valuable from an individual standpoint. Sometimes that
would be collaborating through code, if it comes down to it. From an
overarching perspective, I view hands-on coding by TC to be somewhat
of a last resort effort due to individual commitments.

Perceptions surrounding actions, like the oft used 'stepping up'
phrase, creates an effect where people do not carve out enough time to
effect change, becoming too busy, repeat ad infinitum.

Best,
Samuel

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