Mailing List Archive

On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk>
wrote:

> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
> > Hoi Daryl,
> >
> > There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data like
> > this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
> > between two installation on one physical system.
> >
> > usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The computer
> > uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
> > mortals it translates it to a name.
> >
> > However the translation between the numerical id's and the names is
> > unique to every installation, with the only exception of root. Root
> > always has a uid of 0 and a gid of 0. Some of the groups have
> > generally by agreement the same gid, but they could be another.
> >
> > So if you create a new installation and want to copy or share data
> > with an old installation you have to ensure the involved users and
> > groups have the same uid and gid on both installations. You can set
> > the uid on user creation (if not already taken by another user).
> >
> > This is why I use ldap for network wide user and group management. The
> > user hika and mythtv have the same uid on all computers and most
> > groups likewise.
> >
> I would add another complication, which I discovered copying a disk from
> an old backend to a new one
> (duff motherboard). Many of the users and groups generated by a fresh
> install are "system" users;
> that means they are usually used only by OS subsystems. These are less
> than 1000 and typically
> assigned the next available numbers. As the order of installation is
> indeterminate during an OS
> install, these are essentially random and won't match the UIDs and GIDs on
> any other host.
>
> Mythtv as installed from repos is often treated as a "system" install,
> meaning that the UID and GID
> the user "mythtv" is assigned can often collide with UIDs from other
> subsystems like, for example,
> gdm and lxd.
>
> For this reason I now *always* create a mythtv user with a known UID and
> GID in the normal user
> range (> 1000) before installing any software. That ensures (i) there are
> no collisions, (ii) any
> existing video files still have the right UID and GID, (iii) the user is
> created under /home rather
> than under /var, and (iv) if I access those directories from elsewhere I
> get sensible answers from NFS.
>
> --
>
> Mike Perkins
>
So, in my case, with a clean install of 22.04/32 on a separate partition of
the 120GB OS ssd and a database restore from 20.04/31 there are bound to be
these kinds of issues? Unless I'm one in one thousand lucky, ouch.

>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users@mythtv.org
> http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
> MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
>

Hoi Daryl,

Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:




> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
> <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:

> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
>> Hoi Daryl,
>>
>> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data like
>> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
>> between two installation on one physical system.
>>
>> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The computer
>> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
>> mortals it translates it to a name.
>>
>> However the translation between the numerical id's and the names is
>> unique to every installation, with the only exception of root. Root
>> always has a uid of 0 and a gid of 0. Some of the groups have
>> generally by agreement the same gid, but they could be another.
>>
>> So if you create a new installation and want to copy or share data
>> with an old installation you have to ensure the involved users and
>> groups have the same uid and gid on both installations. You can set
>> the uid on user creation (if not already taken by another user).
>>
>> This is why I use ldap for network wide user and group management. The
>> user hika and mythtv have the same uid on all computers and most
>> groups likewise.
>>
> I would add another complication, which I discovered copying a
> disk from an old backend to a new one
> (duff motherboard). Many of the users and groups generated by a
> fresh install are "system" users;
> that means they are usually used only by OS subsystems. These are less than 1000 and typically
> assigned the next available numbers. As the order of installation is indeterminate during an OS
> install, these are essentially random and won't match the UIDs and GIDs on any other host.
>
> Mythtv as installed from repos is often treated as a "system"
> install, meaning that the UID and GID
> the user "mythtv" is assigned can often collide with UIDs from
> other subsystems like, for example,
> gdm and lxd.
>
> For this reason I now *always* create a mythtv user with a known UID and GID in the normal user
> range (> 1000) before installing any software. That ensures (i)
> there are no collisions, (ii) any
> existing video files still have the right UID and GID, (iii) the
> user is created under /home rather
> than under /var, and (iv) if I access those directories from
> elsewhere I get sensible answers from NFS.
>
> --
>
> Mike Perkins


> So, in my case, with a clean install of 22.04/32 on a separate
> partition of the 120GB OS ssd and a database restore from 20.04/31
> there are bound to be these kinds of issues? Unless I'm one in one thousand lucky, ouch. 
>
>
Yes, and the smartest move would be to start over your 22.04 install
and this time create the mythtv and daryl user as the first thing
after you created the basic install and before you install any other
software and with the same uid as on your 20.04 install.
If you haven't copied over much you can try to repair, but chances are
you either fix to much or to little and stumble into it again in 6
months or so.

I don't have the commands ready at hand as I rarely use them, but I
can look it up.


Tot mails,
Hika mailto:hikavdh@gmail.com

"Zonder hoop kun je niet leven
Zonder leven is er geen hoop
Het eeuwige dilemma
Zeker als je hoop moet vernietigen om te kunnen overleven!"

De lerende Mens

_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org

On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:49 PM Hika van den Hoven <hikavdh@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hoi Daryl,
>
> Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:
>
>
>
>
> > On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
> > <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>
> > On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
> >> Hoi Daryl,
> >>
> >> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data like
> >> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
> >> between two installation on one physical system.
> >>
> >> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The computer
> >> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
> >> mortals it translates it to a name.
> >>
> >> However the translation between the numerical id's and the names is
> >> unique to every installation, with the only exception of root. Root
> >> always has a uid of 0 and a gid of 0. Some of the groups have
> >> generally by agreement the same gid, but they could be another.
> >>
> >> So if you create a new installation and want to copy or share data
> >> with an old installation you have to ensure the involved users and
> >> groups have the same uid and gid on both installations. You can set
> >> the uid on user creation (if not already taken by another user).
> >>
> >> This is why I use ldap for network wide user and group management. The
> >> user hika and mythtv have the same uid on all computers and most
> >> groups likewise.
> >>
> > I would add another complication, which I discovered copying a
> > disk from an old backend to a new one
> > (duff motherboard). Many of the users and groups generated by a
> > fresh install are "system" users;
> > that means they are usually used only by OS subsystems. These are less
> than 1000 and typically
> > assigned the next available numbers. As the order of installation is
> indeterminate during an OS
> > install, these are essentially random and won't match the UIDs and GIDs
> on any other host.
> >
> > Mythtv as installed from repos is often treated as a "system"
> > install, meaning that the UID and GID
> > the user "mythtv" is assigned can often collide with UIDs from
> > other subsystems like, for example,
> > gdm and lxd.
> >
> > For this reason I now *always* create a mythtv user with a known UID
> and GID in the normal user
> > range (> 1000) before installing any software. That ensures (i)
> > there are no collisions, (ii) any
> > existing video files still have the right UID and GID, (iii) the
> > user is created under /home rather
> > than under /var, and (iv) if I access those directories from
> > elsewhere I get sensible answers from NFS.
> >
> > --
> >
> > Mike Perkins
>
>
> > So, in my case, with a clean install of 22.04/32 on a separate
> > partition of the 120GB OS ssd and a database restore from 20.04/31
> > there are bound to be these kinds of issues? Unless I'm one in one
> thousand lucky, ouch.
> >
> >
> Yes, and the smartest move would be to start over your 22.04 install
> and this time create the mythtv and daryl user as the first thing
> after you created the basic install and before you install any other
> software and with the same uid as on your 20.04 install.
> If you haven't copied over much you can try to repair, but chances are
> you either fix to much or to little and stumble into it again in 6
> months or so.
>
> I don't have the commands ready at hand as I rarely use them, but I
> can look it up.
>
>
> Tot mails,
> Hika mailto:hikavdh@gmail.com
>
> "Zonder hoop kun je niet leven
> Zonder leven is er geen hoop
> Het eeuwige dilemma
> Zeker als je hoop moet vernietigen om te kunnen overleven!"
>
> De lerende Mens
>
Okay, so how do I determine the UID's from 20.04, and if I can do that why
can't I manipulate the UId's in 22.04 ?

>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users@mythtv.org
> http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
> MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
>

Hoi Daryl,

Saturday, January 7, 2023, 1:52:06 AM, you wrote:




> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:49 PM Hika van den Hoven <hikavdh@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hoi Daryl,
>
> Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:
>
>
>
>
>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
>> <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
 >>> Hoi Daryl,
 >>>
 >>> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data like
 >>> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
 >>> between two installation on one physical system.
 >>>
 >>> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The computer
 >>> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
 >>> mortals it translates it to a name.
 >>>
 >>> However the translation between the numerical id's and the names is
 >>> unique to every installation, with the only exception of root. Root
 >>> always has a uid of 0 and a gid of 0. Some of the groups have
 >>> generally by agreement the same gid, but they could be another.
 >>>
 >>> So if you create a new installation and want to copy or share data
 >>> with an old installation you have to ensure the involved users and
 >>> groups have the same uid and gid on both installations. You can set
 >>> the uid on user creation (if not already taken by another user).
 >>>
 >>> This is why I use ldap for network wide user and group management. The
 >>> user hika and mythtv have the same uid on all computers and most
 >>> groups likewise.
 >>>
>>  I would add another complication, which I discovered copying a
>> disk from an old backend to a new one
>>  (duff motherboard). Many of the users and groups generated by a
>> fresh install are "system" users;
>>  that means they are usually used only by OS subsystems. These are less than 1000 and typically
>>  assigned the next available numbers. As the order of installation is indeterminate during an OS
>>  install, these are essentially random and won't match the UIDs and GIDs on any other host.
>> 
>>  Mythtv as installed from repos is often treated as a "system"
>> install, meaning that the UID and GID
>>  the user "mythtv" is assigned can often collide with UIDs from
>> other subsystems like, for example,
>>  gdm and lxd.
>> 
>>  For this reason I now *always* create a mythtv user with a known UID and GID in the normal user
>>  range (> 1000) before installing any software. That ensures (i)
>> there are no collisions, (ii) any
>>  existing video files still have the right UID and GID, (iii) the
>> user is created under /home rather
>>  than under /var, and (iv) if I access those directories from
>> elsewhere I get sensible answers from NFS.
>> 
>>  --
>> 
>>  Mike Perkins
>
>
>> So, in my case, with a clean install of 22.04/32 on a separate
>> partition of the 120GB OS ssd and a database restore from 20.04/31
>> there are bound to be these kinds of issues? Unless I'm one in one thousand lucky, ouch. 
>> 
>> 
> Yes, and the smartest move would be to start over your 22.04 install
> and this time create the mythtv and daryl user as the first thing
> after you created the basic install and before you install any other
> software and with the same uid as on your 20.04 install.
> If you haven't copied over much you can try to repair, but chances are
> you either fix to much or to little and stumble into it again in 6
> months or so.
>
> I don't have the commands ready at hand as I rarely use them, but I
> can look it up.
>
>
> Tot mails,
>   Hika                            mailto:hikavdh@gmail.com
>
> "Zonder hoop kun je niet leven
> Zonder leven is er geen hoop
> Het eeuwige dilemma
> Zeker als je hoop moet vernietigen om te kunnen overleven!"
>
> De lerende Mens


> Okay, so how do I determine the UID's from 20.04, and if I can do

You can. Look at the files /etc/shadow and /etc/group
DO NOT EDIT THEM!
open them with the `less` command.
less /etc/shadow

shadow gives the username, the uid, the primarily gid, the shell,
etc.
group translates gids to names.

> that why can't I manipulate the UId's in 22.04 ?
>

You can, but are you sure which uid's and gids's relate to which
install? It depends on what actions you have taken in between. And
those are always more then you remember.

Take it from someone who has been in similar situations. If you have
the opportunity to start afresh,... take it!
In the end it takes less time and frustration. AND you learn more.

Look at the syntax for the command useradd
man useradd
for adding your users

The same for groupadd and groupmems for groups and groupmemberships.

Tot mails,
Hika mailto:hikavdh@gmail.com

"Zonder hoop kun je niet leven
Zonder leven is er geen hoop
Het eeuwige dilemma
Zeker als je hoop moet vernietigen om te kunnen overleven!"

De lerende Mens

_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org

> On 7 Jan 2023, at 7:49 am, Hika van den Hoven <hikavdh@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hoi Daryl,
>
> Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:
>
>
>
>
>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
>> <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
>>> Hoi Daryl,
>>>
>>> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data like
>>> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
>>> between two installation on one physical system.
>>>
>>> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The computer
>>> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
>>> mortals it translates it to a name.

Slight Disagreement:

userId and groupId on a system are defined in /etc/passwd and /etc/group

Files are stored with GID and UID

so if on system 1

UID 1000 is me
UID 1001 is mythtv

and on system 2

UID 1001 is me
UID 1002 is mythtv


Files on system1 belonging to me on system2 would belong to 1000
Files on system1 belonging to mythtv on system2 would belong to me

All easy to comprehend. Of passing interest first UUID of 1000 is abitary. HPUX used to use 500, and you are free to use (say) 789. # chown -R is your friend

James
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org

I’m only being pedantic because I hate unqualified words of wisdom

>> Okay, so how do I determine the UID's from 20.04, and if I can do
>
> You can. Look at the files /etc/shadow and /etc/group
> DO NOT EDIT THEM!

To err is human to really #!@$ things up you need a computer!
but
I only ever change groups with vi.

> open them with the `less` command.
> less /etc/shadow

/etc/shadow is made secret so that *bad guys* can’t read the cryped passwd and work on it.

Anybody can read /etc/passwd

$ less /etc/passwd

but only root can read shadow

# less /etc/shadow ($ sudo less /etc/shadow)

James
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
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http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org

On 07/01/2023 09:17, James Linder wrote:
>
>
>> On 7 Jan 2023, at 7:49 am, Hika van den Hoven <hikavdh@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hoi Daryl,
>>
>> Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
>>> <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
>>>> Hoi Daryl,
>>>>
>>>> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data like
>>>> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
>>>> between two installation on one physical system.
>>>>
>>>> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The computer
>>>> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
>>>> mortals it translates it to a name.
>
> Slight Disagreement:
>
> userId and groupId on a system are defined in /etc/passwd and /etc/group
>
> Files are stored with GID and UID
>
> so if on system 1
>
> UID 1000 is me
> UID 1001 is mythtv
>
> and on system 2
>
> UID 1001 is me
> UID 1002 is mythtv
>
>
> Files on system1 belonging to me on system2 would belong to 1000
> Files on system1 belonging to mythtv on system2 would belong to me
>
> All easy to comprehend. Of passing interest first UUID of 1000 is abitary. HPUX used to use 500, and you are free to use (say) 789. # chown -R is your friend
>
Debian-based systems like Ubuntu reserve UIDs 1-999 for 'system' users, most of which cannot be
logged into by a normal user. Some install scripts just use the next available UID, others seem to
pick fixed ones from that range, which is one reason we have this mess. UIDs 1-999 can thus be
assigned in any arbitrary order to various subsystems.

The first usable user UID is 1000, and this (for Debian, Ubuntu etc may do something different) is
assigned to the user you are prompted to create during installation. This user is often slightly
more privileged than subsequent ones.

I believe, though I do not use them, that other ranges (eg 5000 up) may be used for NIS, LDAP or
other externally-created or 'special' user categories.

--

Mike Perkins


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mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
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> On 7 Jan 2023, at 6:48 pm, Mike Perkins <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>
> On 07/01/2023 09:17, James Linder wrote:
>>> On 7 Jan 2023, at 7:49 am, Hika van den Hoven <hikavdh@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hoi Daryl,
>>>
>>> Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
>>>> <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
>>>>> Hoi Daryl,
>>>>>
>>>>> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data like
>>>>> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
>>>>> between two installation on one physical system.
>>>>>
>>>>> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The computer
>>>>> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
>>>>> mortals it translates it to a name.
>> Slight Disagreement:
>> userId and groupId on a system are defined in /etc/passwd and /etc/group
>> Files are stored with GID and UID
>> so if on system 1
>> UID 1000 is me
>> UID 1001 is mythtv
>> and on system 2
>> UID 1001 is me
>> UID 1002 is mythtv
>> Files on system1 belonging to me on system2 would belong to 1000
>> Files on system1 belonging to mythtv on system2 would belong to me
>> All easy to comprehend. Of passing interest first UUID of 1000 is abitary. HPUX used to use 500, and you are free to use (say) 789. # chown -R is your friend
> Debian-based systems like Ubuntu reserve UIDs 1-999 for 'system' users, most of which cannot be logged into by a normal user. Some install scripts just use the next available UID, others seem to pick fixed ones from that range, which is one reason we have this mess. UIDs 1-999 can thus be assigned in any arbitrary order to various subsystems.
>
> The first usable user UID is 1000, and this (for Debian, Ubuntu etc may do something different) is assigned to the user you are prompted to create during installation. This user is often slightly more privileged than subsequent ones.
>
> I believe, though I do not use them, that other ranges (eg 5000 up) may be used for NIS, LDAP or other externally-created or 'special' user categories.

Mike thanks for comments. I never learn (and will do 100 lines punishment) that debian et al contribute greatly to the chaos by inventing scores of special rules. But in general my post is correct and de-mysifies the chaos, also there are other distros that wont enforce debian's version of the OneTrueWay

James
_______________________________________________
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On 07/01/2023 11:22, James Linder wrote:
>
>
>> On 7 Jan 2023, at 6:48 pm, Mike Perkins <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>>
>> On 07/01/2023 09:17, James Linder wrote:
>>>> On 7 Jan 2023, at 7:49 am, Hika van den Hoven <hikavdh@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hoi Daryl,
>>>>
>>>> Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
>>>>> <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
>>>>>> Hoi Daryl,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data like
>>>>>> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
>>>>>> between two installation on one physical system.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The computer
>>>>>> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
>>>>>> mortals it translates it to a name.
>>> Slight Disagreement:
>>> userId and groupId on a system are defined in /etc/passwd and /etc/group
>>> Files are stored with GID and UID
>>> so if on system 1
>>> UID 1000 is me
>>> UID 1001 is mythtv
>>> and on system 2
>>> UID 1001 is me
>>> UID 1002 is mythtv
>>> Files on system1 belonging to me on system2 would belong to 1000
>>> Files on system1 belonging to mythtv on system2 would belong to me
>>> All easy to comprehend. Of passing interest first UUID of 1000 is abitary. HPUX used to use 500, and you are free to use (say) 789. # chown -R is your friend
>> Debian-based systems like Ubuntu reserve UIDs 1-999 for 'system' users, most of which cannot be logged into by a normal user. Some install scripts just use the next available UID, others seem to pick fixed ones from that range, which is one reason we have this mess. UIDs 1-999 can thus be assigned in any arbitrary order to various subsystems.
>>
>> The first usable user UID is 1000, and this (for Debian, Ubuntu etc may do something different) is assigned to the user you are prompted to create during installation. This user is often slightly more privileged than subsequent ones.
>>
>> I believe, though I do not use them, that other ranges (eg 5000 up) may be used for NIS, LDAP or other externally-created or 'special' user categories.
>
> Mike thanks for comments. I never learn (and will do 100 lines punishment) that debian et al contribute greatly to the chaos by inventing scores of special rules. But in general my post is correct and de-mysifies the chaos, also there are other distros that wont enforce debian's version of the OneTrueWay
>
It would probably have helped if there had been the equivalent for UIDs like there is for Ethernet
port numbers: the "well-known" port number list (/etc/services). However, that horse has long since
bolted. Welcome to the land of standards!

Unfortunately most users only discover these things out the hard way: when they build a new system
and things get really weird. Some say that is one reason Windows is popular, since you leave that
kind of mess for Microsoft to sort out, but unfortunately they found other ways to over-complicate
matters like the Registry.

TL;DR: Every OS has ideas on consistency. Unfortunately, they all have completely different failings
as well.

--

Mike Perkins


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Thanks for all the explanations. This all started because I tried a "free"
VPN for Kodi, which broke my internet connection on the next boot, so I
decided to go ahead with the upgrade to 22.04/32fixes. I had slowly been
getting this ready doing all the extra bits before mythtv which probably
misaligned the UID's causing more problems. The solution for me came
through my pillow. Being unable to edit /etc/resolv.conf to solve the
connection issue I was able to edit /run/systemd/resolve/stub-resolv.conf
which did solve my connection problem. Then I did a 31 to 32 upgrade and
restored the database from 22.04 and so far all looks well. I will probably
wipe the 22.04 install and start over, at my leisure, am I understanding
correctly, that if I install mythtv first and then the other bits, kodi,
chrome, zoom, etc it would work that way?

On Sat, Jan 7, 2023 at 6:23 AM James Linder <jam@tigger.ws> wrote:

>
>
> > On 7 Jan 2023, at 6:48 pm, Mike Perkins <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk>
> wrote:
> >
> > On 07/01/2023 09:17, James Linder wrote:
> >>> On 7 Jan 2023, at 7:49 am, Hika van den Hoven <hikavdh@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hoi Daryl,
> >>>
> >>> Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
> >>>> <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
> >>>>> Hoi Daryl,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data
> like
> >>>>> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
> >>>>> between two installation on one physical system.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The
> computer
> >>>>> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
> >>>>> mortals it translates it to a name.
> >> Slight Disagreement:
> >> userId and groupId on a system are defined in /etc/passwd and /etc/group
> >> Files are stored with GID and UID
> >> so if on system 1
> >> UID 1000 is me
> >> UID 1001 is mythtv
> >> and on system 2
> >> UID 1001 is me
> >> UID 1002 is mythtv
> >> Files on system1 belonging to me on system2 would belong to 1000
> >> Files on system1 belonging to mythtv on system2 would belong to me
> >> All easy to comprehend. Of passing interest first UUID of 1000 is
> abitary. HPUX used to use 500, and you are free to use (say) 789. # chown
> -R is your friend
> > Debian-based systems like Ubuntu reserve UIDs 1-999 for 'system' users,
> most of which cannot be logged into by a normal user. Some install scripts
> just use the next available UID, others seem to pick fixed ones from that
> range, which is one reason we have this mess. UIDs 1-999 can thus be
> assigned in any arbitrary order to various subsystems.
> >
> > The first usable user UID is 1000, and this (for Debian, Ubuntu etc may
> do something different) is assigned to the user you are prompted to create
> during installation. This user is often slightly more privileged than
> subsequent ones.
> >
> > I believe, though I do not use them, that other ranges (eg 5000 up) may
> be used for NIS, LDAP or other externally-created or 'special' user
> categories.
>
> Mike thanks for comments. I never learn (and will do 100 lines punishment)
> that debian et al contribute greatly to the chaos by inventing scores of
> special rules. But in general my post is correct and de-mysifies the chaos,
> also there are other distros that wont enforce debian's version of the
> OneTrueWay
>
> James
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users@mythtv.org
> http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
> MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
>

My edit did not survive a reboot. In 22.04 the link points to an empty
file, so would it work to rename the file by
"sudo
mv /run/systemd/resolve/stub-resolv.conf
/run/systemd/resolve/stub-resolv.conf-vpn"
then create the file "/run/systemd/resolve/stub-resolv.conf" or move it
from the 22.04 system

On Sat, Jan 7, 2023 at 6:41 AM Daryl McDonald <darylangela@gmail.com> wrote:

> Thanks for all the explanations. This all started because I tried a "free"
> VPN for Kodi, which broke my internet connection on the next boot, so I
> decided to go ahead with the upgrade to 22.04/32fixes. I had slowly been
> getting this ready doing all the extra bits before mythtv which probably
> misaligned the UID's causing more problems. The solution for me came
> through my pillow. Being unable to edit /etc/resolv.conf to solve the
> connection issue I was able to edit /run/systemd/resolve/stub-resolv.conf
> which did solve my connection problem. Then I did a 31 to 32 upgrade and
> restored the database from 22.04 and so far all looks well. I will probably
> wipe the 22.04 install and start over, at my leisure, am I understanding
> correctly, that if I install mythtv first and then the other bits, kodi,
> chrome, zoom, etc it would work that way?
>
> On Sat, Jan 7, 2023 at 6:23 AM James Linder <jam@tigger.ws> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> > On 7 Jan 2023, at 6:48 pm, Mike Perkins <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > On 07/01/2023 09:17, James Linder wrote:
>> >>> On 7 Jan 2023, at 7:49 am, Hika van den Hoven <hikavdh@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Hoi Daryl,
>> >>>
>> >>> Saturday, January 7, 2023, 12:18:00 AM, you wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2023 at 6:09 PM Mike Perkins
>> >>>> <mikep@randomtraveller.org.uk> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> On 06/01/2023 21:01, Hika van den Hoven wrote:
>> >>>>> Hoi Daryl,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> There is one thing you always have to remember when you move data
>> like
>> >>>>> this between old and new systems or even more important, share them
>> >>>>> between two installation on one physical system.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> usernames and groupnames are meaningless to the computer. The
>> computer
>> >>>>> uses the numerical u(ser)id and g(roup)id. For our benefit as stupid
>> >>>>> mortals it translates it to a name.
>> >> Slight Disagreement:
>> >> userId and groupId on a system are defined in /etc/passwd and
>> /etc/group
>> >> Files are stored with GID and UID
>> >> so if on system 1
>> >> UID 1000 is me
>> >> UID 1001 is mythtv
>> >> and on system 2
>> >> UID 1001 is me
>> >> UID 1002 is mythtv
>> >> Files on system1 belonging to me on system2 would belong to 1000
>> >> Files on system1 belonging to mythtv on system2 would belong to me
>> >> All easy to comprehend. Of passing interest first UUID of 1000 is
>> abitary. HPUX used to use 500, and you are free to use (say) 789. # chown
>> -R is your friend
>> > Debian-based systems like Ubuntu reserve UIDs 1-999 for 'system' users,
>> most of which cannot be logged into by a normal user. Some install scripts
>> just use the next available UID, others seem to pick fixed ones from that
>> range, which is one reason we have this mess. UIDs 1-999 can thus be
>> assigned in any arbitrary order to various subsystems.
>> >
>> > The first usable user UID is 1000, and this (for Debian, Ubuntu etc may
>> do something different) is assigned to the user you are prompted to create
>> during installation. This user is often slightly more privileged than
>> subsequent ones.
>> >
>> > I believe, though I do not use them, that other ranges (eg 5000 up) may
>> be used for NIS, LDAP or other externally-created or 'special' user
>> categories.
>>
>> Mike thanks for comments. I never learn (and will do 100 lines
>> punishment) that debian et al contribute greatly to the chaos by inventing
>> scores of special rules. But in general my post is correct and de-mysifies
>> the chaos, also there are other distros that wont enforce debian's version
>> of the OneTrueWay
>>
>> James
>> _______________________________________________
>> mythtv-users mailing list
>> mythtv-users@mythtv.org
>> http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>> http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
>> MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
>>
>