FYI:
Technical Presentation: SnapMirror Cloud SE Presentation (9.12.1):
https://fieldportal.netapp.com/content/1236843?assetComponentId=1239342
Sebastian
On 28.11.2022 19:19, Michael Bergman via Toasters wrote:
> From:
> Michael Bergman via Toasters <toasters@teaparty.net>
> Date:
> 28.11.2022, 19:19
>
> To:
> Toasters <toasters@teaparty.net>
>
>
>
> Re: NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage.eml
>
> Subject:
> Re: NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage
> From:
> Michael Bergman <michael.bergman@ericsson.com>
> Date:
> 28.11.2022, 19:19
>
> To:
> Toasters <toasters@teaparty.net>
>
>
> On 2022-11-28 17:22, Douglas Siggins wrote:
>> Can someone please clarify this for me? My understanding is that cloud
>> backup is just scheduling the snap diff v3 to object storage. You could get
>> similar functionality by any vendor that netapp approves, of which I believe
>> there are 4 others?
> First of all: nothing of what I write below has anything to do with "S3
> Bucket mirror" from a Primary ONTAP system which does S3 storage.
>
> CBS (Cloud Backup Service) is something that originally runs in-Cloud only.
> That's where it was always meant to live. But now it can also run
> "off-Cloud" (= on-prem), in something called NetApp Cloud Manager Dark Site
> Edition. Which you'd then need to install in your own environment first, I
> think it's a VM (ESXi) image for example.
> CBS an orchestrator which uses SnapDiff v3 and leverage SnapMirror Cloud to
> take "snapshots" (block diffs just like SnapMirror/-Vault does) and puts it
> in an S3 Bucket. For on-prem S3 systems, only StorageGRID and ONTAP are
> approved today. Not minIO or anything else.
>
> There are other vendors yes, tech partners, which have paid NetApp to use
> SnapDiff v3 and SnapMirror Cloud in the same fashion CBS does. That product,
> e.g. Cleondris Appliance or Rubrik Foundation Suite, then does all the
> orchestration and configuration of your backups, the work that SnapVault
> does inside ONTAP traditionally. That product will have to keep track of
> all the files and blocks, what belongs where: all the backup metadata. All
> that which a SnapVault target system's ONTAP (WAFL) will keep track of
> traditionally.
>
> To use a 3rd party product in that list, you need to purchase something
> called HCB (Hybrid Cloud Bundle) from NetApp. To enable the SM Cloud +
> SnapDiff v3 from the ONTAP side so to speak. You have to pay for it per TiB
> (Tebibyte) "physical used data" which you have backed up to your S3 target
> system. The definition of this is as opposed to "logical used data" which
> CBS uses. I won't go into the distinction here because I do not want to
> cause even more confusion. All this*is* confusing, indeed. Talk to your
> account team and force them to penetrate this and explain it to you properly!
>
> Douglas Siggins wrote:
>> I tried getting licenses to try this on premise to ontap s3 and was
>> immediately turned away. It's super unclear how netapp intends to position
>> this cloud. Has anyone been able to try the inbuilt backup to an ontap or
>> grid target?
> Hm. Interesting. You were "turned away"...? By your account team at NetApp?
> I agree that things are rather unclear around this.
> If you wish to use CBS on-prem, then clearly as things have progressed these
> days NetApp compete directly with their tech partners products: Rubrik,
> Cleondris, ProLion, CommVault (those which have licensed SnapDiff v3).
> The price models are in constant flux and have been for at least 12 months.
> It's confusing and can only get better for us who have huge on-prem
> environments and want to leverage at least some of the new in-Cloud
> cleverness NetApp has come up with over the past 24 months.
>
> /M
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: SV: NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage
> Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2022 14:03:38 +0000
> From: Heino Walther<hw@beardmann.dk>
> To: Florian Schmid<fschmid@ubimet.com>,"toasters@teaparty.net"
> <toasters@teaparty.net>
>
> Hi Florian
>
> The short answer is no.
>
> What the cloud-backup as you call it, does, it to move ?older? datablocks to
> an S3 target or it can move blocks in your snapshots.
>
> So the information of where the blocks are stored is still in the original
> volume, and you need to back that information up either by SnapMirror/Vault
> or an NDMP dump.
>
> Also, if you plan using anything else than another ONTAP or StorageGRID, you
> will need to buy license?
>
> If you do not have another NetApp system to SnapMirror to, I would look into
> NDMP backup as an option? it is supported by most backup products like
> BackupExec etc?
>
> /Heino
>
> *Fra: *Florian Schmid<fschmid@ubimet.com>
> *Dato: *mandag, 28. november 2022 kl. 14.45
> *Til: *toasters@teaparty.net<toasters@teaparty.net>
> *Emne: *NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage
>
> Hi there,
>
> I wanted to ask, if someone knows or has this done already, if you can
> backup your on premise NetApp Ontap volumes to a 3rd party S3 storage.
>
> As far as I understand this so called "cloud-backup", it can send snapshot
> diffs (block based) to a S3 storage like AWS or on-premise StorageGrid nodes.
>
> But would this also work to 3rd party S3 storage tools like minIO?
>
> Let's image we have a huge on-premise S3 storage running minIO or what ever
> vendor, can I use this also as a target for my Ontap volume backup?
>
> NetApp itself is only mentioning 3rd party S3 storage for tiering, but not
> for backup.
>
> If this is not possible, is there another possibility to backup volume
> snapshot diffs to a non netapp storage? It must be block based and not file
> based backup.
>
> Best regards
> Florian
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Toasters mailing list
> Toasters@teaparty.net
> https://www.teaparty.net/mailman/listinfo/toasters
> Attachments:
>
> Re: NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage.eml 14,0 KB
>
Technical Presentation: SnapMirror Cloud SE Presentation (9.12.1):
https://fieldportal.netapp.com/content/1236843?assetComponentId=1239342
Sebastian
On 28.11.2022 19:19, Michael Bergman via Toasters wrote:
> From:
> Michael Bergman via Toasters <toasters@teaparty.net>
> Date:
> 28.11.2022, 19:19
>
> To:
> Toasters <toasters@teaparty.net>
>
>
>
> Re: NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage.eml
>
> Subject:
> Re: NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage
> From:
> Michael Bergman <michael.bergman@ericsson.com>
> Date:
> 28.11.2022, 19:19
>
> To:
> Toasters <toasters@teaparty.net>
>
>
> On 2022-11-28 17:22, Douglas Siggins wrote:
>> Can someone please clarify this for me? My understanding is that cloud
>> backup is just scheduling the snap diff v3 to object storage. You could get
>> similar functionality by any vendor that netapp approves, of which I believe
>> there are 4 others?
> First of all: nothing of what I write below has anything to do with "S3
> Bucket mirror" from a Primary ONTAP system which does S3 storage.
>
> CBS (Cloud Backup Service) is something that originally runs in-Cloud only.
> That's where it was always meant to live. But now it can also run
> "off-Cloud" (= on-prem), in something called NetApp Cloud Manager Dark Site
> Edition. Which you'd then need to install in your own environment first, I
> think it's a VM (ESXi) image for example.
> CBS an orchestrator which uses SnapDiff v3 and leverage SnapMirror Cloud to
> take "snapshots" (block diffs just like SnapMirror/-Vault does) and puts it
> in an S3 Bucket. For on-prem S3 systems, only StorageGRID and ONTAP are
> approved today. Not minIO or anything else.
>
> There are other vendors yes, tech partners, which have paid NetApp to use
> SnapDiff v3 and SnapMirror Cloud in the same fashion CBS does. That product,
> e.g. Cleondris Appliance or Rubrik Foundation Suite, then does all the
> orchestration and configuration of your backups, the work that SnapVault
> does inside ONTAP traditionally. That product will have to keep track of
> all the files and blocks, what belongs where: all the backup metadata. All
> that which a SnapVault target system's ONTAP (WAFL) will keep track of
> traditionally.
>
> To use a 3rd party product in that list, you need to purchase something
> called HCB (Hybrid Cloud Bundle) from NetApp. To enable the SM Cloud +
> SnapDiff v3 from the ONTAP side so to speak. You have to pay for it per TiB
> (Tebibyte) "physical used data" which you have backed up to your S3 target
> system. The definition of this is as opposed to "logical used data" which
> CBS uses. I won't go into the distinction here because I do not want to
> cause even more confusion. All this*is* confusing, indeed. Talk to your
> account team and force them to penetrate this and explain it to you properly!
>
> Douglas Siggins wrote:
>> I tried getting licenses to try this on premise to ontap s3 and was
>> immediately turned away. It's super unclear how netapp intends to position
>> this cloud. Has anyone been able to try the inbuilt backup to an ontap or
>> grid target?
> Hm. Interesting. You were "turned away"...? By your account team at NetApp?
> I agree that things are rather unclear around this.
> If you wish to use CBS on-prem, then clearly as things have progressed these
> days NetApp compete directly with their tech partners products: Rubrik,
> Cleondris, ProLion, CommVault (those which have licensed SnapDiff v3).
> The price models are in constant flux and have been for at least 12 months.
> It's confusing and can only get better for us who have huge on-prem
> environments and want to leverage at least some of the new in-Cloud
> cleverness NetApp has come up with over the past 24 months.
>
> /M
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: SV: NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage
> Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2022 14:03:38 +0000
> From: Heino Walther<hw@beardmann.dk>
> To: Florian Schmid<fschmid@ubimet.com>,"toasters@teaparty.net"
> <toasters@teaparty.net>
>
> Hi Florian
>
> The short answer is no.
>
> What the cloud-backup as you call it, does, it to move ?older? datablocks to
> an S3 target or it can move blocks in your snapshots.
>
> So the information of where the blocks are stored is still in the original
> volume, and you need to back that information up either by SnapMirror/Vault
> or an NDMP dump.
>
> Also, if you plan using anything else than another ONTAP or StorageGRID, you
> will need to buy license?
>
> If you do not have another NetApp system to SnapMirror to, I would look into
> NDMP backup as an option? it is supported by most backup products like
> BackupExec etc?
>
> /Heino
>
> *Fra: *Florian Schmid<fschmid@ubimet.com>
> *Dato: *mandag, 28. november 2022 kl. 14.45
> *Til: *toasters@teaparty.net<toasters@teaparty.net>
> *Emne: *NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage
>
> Hi there,
>
> I wanted to ask, if someone knows or has this done already, if you can
> backup your on premise NetApp Ontap volumes to a 3rd party S3 storage.
>
> As far as I understand this so called "cloud-backup", it can send snapshot
> diffs (block based) to a S3 storage like AWS or on-premise StorageGrid nodes.
>
> But would this also work to 3rd party S3 storage tools like minIO?
>
> Let's image we have a huge on-premise S3 storage running minIO or what ever
> vendor, can I use this also as a target for my Ontap volume backup?
>
> NetApp itself is only mentioning 3rd party S3 storage for tiering, but not
> for backup.
>
> If this is not possible, is there another possibility to backup volume
> snapshot diffs to a non netapp storage? It must be block based and not file
> based backup.
>
> Best regards
> Florian
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Toasters mailing list
> Toasters@teaparty.net
> https://www.teaparty.net/mailman/listinfo/toasters
> Attachments:
>
> Re: NetApp backup to 3rd party S3 storage.eml 14,0 KB
>