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Is CRID an international standard?
Hi *,

Is CRID, <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_reference_identifier>
an international standard, or just something strange that the local TV
stations are using for program IDs in their EITs?

Local stations are being consistent about using the ID part at the end
to identify programs, but are including the sub channel in the first
part, so MythTV thinks that the repeats are different programs.

Is there anything that the user can do about this?

These are the same episode of "At The Movies";
<CRID://melbourne21.abc.net.au/ac1324h040s00>
<CRID://melbourneabcnews24.abc.ne/ac1324h040s00>.
Something seems to have truncated "t.au" from the second one. Could
that be the problem? Can MythTV be told that 21 and 24 (and a couple
of others) share things?

--
testing
bP
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Re: Is CRID an international standard? [ In reply to ]
On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 8:49 AM, blind Pete <0123peter@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi *,
>
> Is CRID, <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_reference_identifier>
> an international standard

Obligatory xkcd ref: http://xkcd.com/927/
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Re: Is CRID an international standard? [ In reply to ]
On Wed, 26 Nov 2014 15:22:17 +0000
Gary Buhrmaster <gary.buhrmaster@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 8:49 AM, blind Pete <0123peter@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Hi *,
> >
> > Is CRID, <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_reference_identifier>
> > an international standard
>
> Obligatory xkcd ref: http://xkcd.com/927/

So using CRIDs as program IDs breaks things from MythTV's point of
view.

--
testing
bP
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Re: Is CRID an international standard? [ In reply to ]
> So using CRIDs as program IDs breaks things from MythTV's point of view.

For me it is not clear which problem you have, but maybe you experience the
same problem I had:
https://www.mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2014-June/364899.html

Maybe the attached patch could be of help for you, it removes the
programID/seriesID from the EIT event, before writing to the DB.
It also describes the problem I had with the programID/seriesID.

Angela
Re: Is CRID an international standard? [ In reply to ]
On Thu, 27 Nov 2014 08:20:29 +0100
"Angela" <angela.schmid@wolke7.net> wrote:

> > So using CRIDs as program IDs breaks things from MythTV's point of
> > view.
>
> For me it is not clear which problem you have, but maybe you
> experience the same problem I had:
> https://www.mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2014-June/364899.html
>
> Maybe the attached patch could be of help for you, it removes the
> programID/seriesID from the EIT event, before writing to the DB.
> It also describes the problem I had with the programID/seriesID.
>
> Angela

The CRID includes information about which sub-channel the broadcast was
on. So, the unique part at the end identifies a program, but the CRID
as a whole differs between the original and the repeat. Even though
titles and descriptions match, MythTV thinks that the programs are
different and records both. It is not a major problem, but it is one of
those little surprises that pop up every now and again.

For a patch to be useful to me I will have to learn how to compile.
That is on my TODO list, but not high on the list. Unfortunately
no-one has any other ideas, so I will continue to kludge the occasional
recording rule and think about mucking about with the compiler later.

Thank you.

--
testing
bP
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Re: Is CRID an international standard? [ In reply to ]
> "Angela" <angela.schmid@wolke7.net> wrote:
> > For me it is not clear which problem you have, but maybe you
> > experience the same problem I had:
> > https://www.mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2014-June/364899.html
> >
> > Maybe the attached patch could be of help for you, it removes the
> > programID/seriesID from the EIT event, before writing to the DB.
> > It also describes the problem I had with the programID/seriesID.
> >
> > Angela
>
> The CRID includes information about which sub-channel the broadcast was
> on. So, the unique part at the end identifies a program, but the CRID as
a
> whole differs between the original and the repeat. Even though titles and
> descriptions match, MythTV thinks that the programs are different and
> records both. It is not a major problem, but it is one of those little
surprises
> that pop up every now and again.
>
> For a patch to be useful to me I will have to learn how to compile.
> That is on my TODO list, but not high on the list. Unfortunately no-one
has
> any other ideas, so I will continue to kludge the occasional recording
rule and
> think about mucking about with the compiler later.

You are describing the exact same problem I have.

Too bad the programID/SeriesID (CRIDs) are not defined by the producer (film
maker). In my case an EPG provider collects the program from all channels
and construct their own CRIDs and generate the EIT events. They are often
not the same for repeats on the same channel, on different channels they
most of the time have other values and are there for useless.

Myth should have on option to use the programID/seriesID for scheduling or
ignore them. I submitted a request:
https://code.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/12327
Don't expect it to be implemented asap. So you might consider my simple
patch as a workaround.

Besides the patch, you should run the following sql once, it takes care to
forget about the recorded history (maybe this is not needed depending on the
scheduling engine, but just to be on the save side):
update mythconverg.recordedprogram
set seriesid = ''
,programid = ''
;



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Re: Is CRID an international standard? [ In reply to ]
On 28 November 2014 at 11:13, Angela <angela.schmid@wolke7.net> wrote:

> Myth should have on option to use the programID/seriesID for scheduling or
> ignore them. I submitted a request:

Considering duplicate detection using programID when generated from
XMLTV data is broken (can't tell difference between season 1 episode
11 and season 11 episode 1, for example) with no sane resolution on
the horizon, this would be a good move and one that I would make use
of*.

Nick

* of course, if it were for my own installation, I'd correct the
programme ID generation code and then fix the entries in oldrecorded,
but I like a challenge :)
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Re: Is CRID an international standard? [ In reply to ]
> On 28 November 2014 at 11:13, Angela <angela.schmid@wolke7.net> wrote:
>
> > Myth should have on option to use the programID/seriesID for
> > scheduling or ignore them. I submitted a request:
>
> Considering duplicate detection using programID when generated from
> XMLTV data is broken (can't tell difference between season 1 episode
> 11 and season 11 episode 1, for example) with no sane resolution on the
> horizon, this would be a good move and one that I would make use of*.
>
> Nick
>
> * of course, if it were for my own installation, I'd correct the programme
ID
> generation code and then fix the entries in oldrecorded, but I like a
challenge

Editing would be a very hard work, as you have to make your own "reliable"
CRIDs. Future repeats come with other CRIDs, so you have to constantly edit
the EPG/oldrecorded.
In my case the CRIDs are sometimes delivered a few minutes before the start
(EIT Table present/following), or even after it started (not taking care for
scheduling and not saved into oldrecorded); all this makes (future)
scheduling very unreliable.

Thx for pointing me to the oldrecorded table, this should be the sql update
I meant:
update mythconverg. oldrecorded
set seriesid = ''
,programid = ''
;

Angela


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Re: Is CRID an international standard? [ In reply to ]
On 11/28/2014 06:28 AM, Nick Morrott wrote:
> On 28 November 2014 at 11:13, Angela wrote:
>
>> Myth should have on option to use the programID/seriesID for scheduling or
>> ignore them. I submitted a request:
> Considering duplicate detection using programID when generated from
> XMLTV data is broken

Yes.

> (can't tell difference between season 1 episode
> 11 and season 11 episode 1, for example)

Actually it can. The first has a 111 and the second a B01 at the end of
the program ID. This has been this way for many years, now.

And if there's any time when the program ID would be impossible to
represent with our structure (i.e. any episode of season 36+ or episode
100+ of any season, no program ID is generated, so MythTV uses the
user-specified duplicate matching method (i.e. subtitle + description or
whatever).

> with no sane resolution on
> the horizon, this would be a good move and one that I would make use
> of*.

Actually, there is--and it's the /only/ sane resolution. The resolution
is likely to be (or at least should be) the removal of the code that
generates program IDs from XMLTV data, since auto-generating them from
generally bad, or at the least, imprecise, data is a broken approach
when we already allow user-specified duplicate matching methods on a
per-recording rule basis.

The problem with auto-generating is that it breaks when 2 series have
the same title. So, after you watched all 24 episodes of Battlestar
Galactica from the original 1978 TV series (all in season 1), MythTV
would think you've seen all 13 episodes of season 1 of the 2004
Battlestar Galactica TV series, and you'd either have to clear your
recording history for the first 13 episodes of Battlestar Galactica 1978
or disable duplicate matching to record the new series. Better would be
to use the data the listings provider gave and /not/ fake a program ID.

Mike
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