Mailing List Archive

Time to retire mythweb?
Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work with the
latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.

Any reason not to retire it at this point?

Thanks,
Richard
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/11/21 10:15 AM, Richard Shaw wrote:
> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work with
> the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.
>
> Any reason not to retire it at this point?
>
> Thanks,
> Richard
>
> _______________________________________________

I find mythweb very useful for looking at program listings, recordings
and recording rules. I do not update with mythweb as I have had problems
before with that. However it is very useful for getting information out.

Maybe it is worth fixing mythweb for php 8. I have not been watching
this, what are the problems?

Peter
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On Sat, Dec 11, 2021 at 9:15 AM Richard Shaw <hobbes1069@gmail.com> wrote:

> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work with the
> latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.
>
> Any reason not to retire it at this point?
>

I use mythweb exclusively for setting up recordings. I find it to be a
nicer interface than the native myth client - at least the last time I
investigated the myth client (circa 0.27).

Also, my myth PVR and TV are in the basement. I can easily set up
recordings on my laptop (or via ssh and lynx from the internet).

I'd be pretty sad to see mythweb go.

Thanks for writing/supporting it - I'd be happy to contribute what I can to
its future.

-m
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On Sat, Dec 11, 2021 at 3:16 PM Richard Shaw <hobbes1069@gmail.com> wrote:

> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work with the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.

I can't find the reference, but the last statement by the
devs that I recall was that mythweb was considered
depreciated, and that while pull requests would be
considered, do not expect updates/fixes.

And there are no pull requests in the repo for php 8
support (and no one has indicated they are actively
working on it, although who knows if someone is
doing so).

With the (upcoming) v32, it has been stated that the
plan was that a new (internal) replacement will be made
available which includes the equivalent functionality,
which is where I suspect most dev time is going towards.



An alternative for those that are running newer
distros that use php 8 could be to build your
own php 7 (likely painful) or run a container
with apache and php 7 (lots of recipes out there
to do so).
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On Sat, 2021-12-11 at 16:52 +0000, Gary Buhrmaster wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 11, 2021 at 3:16 PM Richard Shaw <hobbes1069@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work
> > with the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be
> > updated.
>
> I can't find the reference, but the last statement by the
> devs that I recall was that mythweb was considered
> depreciated, and that while pull requests would be
> considered, do not expect updates/fixes.
>
> And there are no pull requests in the repo for php 8
> support (and no one has indicated they are actively
> working on it, although who knows if someone is
> doing so).

I looked briefly and it didn't look like a major effort to make mythweb
work on php8, but I don't have time at the moment to explore further.

I agree with Peter that I find it very useful for looking at upcoming
recordings, etc, from my desktop system and I hope something can be
developed with the new services API to replace this functionality.

David

_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/11/21 10:52 AM, Gary Buhrmaster wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 11, 2021 at 3:16 PM Richard Shaw <hobbes1069@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work with the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.
>
> I can't find the reference, but the last statement by the
> devs that I recall was that mythweb was considered
> depreciated, and that while pull requests would be
> considered, do not expect updates/fixes.
>
> And there are no pull requests in the repo for php 8
> support (and no one has indicated they are actively
> working on it, although who knows if someone is
> doing so).
>
> With the (upcoming) v32, it has been stated that the
> plan was that a new (internal) replacement will be made
> available which includes the equivalent functionality,
> which is where I suspect most dev time is going towards.
>
>
>
> An alternative for those that are running newer
> distros that use php 8 could be to build your
> own php 7 (likely painful) or run a container
> with apache and php 7 (lots of recipes out there
> to do so).
There was a PR, but the author closed it. I did test it (lightly)
and all pages worked. But the author found that searches failed.

https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/pull/62

I just went to the top level pages and scheduled one recording with
no problems.

--
Bill
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 11/12/2021 16:52, Gary Buhrmaster wrote:

> On Sat, Dec 11, 2021 at 3:16 PM Richard Shaw <hobbes1069@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work with the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.
> I can't find the reference, but the last statement by the
> devs that I recall was that mythweb was considered
> depreciated, and that while pull requests would be
> considered, do not expect updates/fixes.
>
> And there are no pull requests in the repo for php 8
> support (and no one has indicated they are actively
> working on it, although who knows if someone is
> doing so).
>
> With the (upcoming) v32, it has been stated that the
> plan was that a new (internal) replacement will be made
> available which includes the equivalent functionality,
> which is where I suspect most dev time is going towards.
>
>
>
> An alternative for those that are running newer
> distros that use php 8 could be to build your
> own php 7 (likely painful) or run a container
> with apache and php 7 (lots of recipes out there
> to do so).


There was a PR but looks like it got closed because of an undisclosed
issue with it.

https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/issues/63


The hope is to retire MythWeb and create a new web frontend that as well
as incorporating the features of MythWeb and/or WebFrontend it would
also incorporate a new Web Setup stuff allowing the backend to be
configured from a browser or another client that uses the Services API
so mythtv-setup can be removed.


The current plan is to write the new web backend using Angular that will
use the Services API exclusively and not require direct access to the
MythTV database or the Myth protocol.


If there are any developers familiar with Angular would like to help out
with this then please get in touch :)


Paul H.

_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
> Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2021 09:15:19 -0600
> From: Richard Shaw <hobbes1069@gmail.com>

> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work with the
> latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.

> Any reason not to retire it at this point?

As a happy Ubuntu (20.04) user of Mythweb, I sure hope that the PHP
issue is fixable. (I saw the thread on mythtv-users but don't have
a good idea of what would be involved in fixing it.)

Mythweb is 99% of how I interact with Myth, and if it won't work after
some PHP version, that'll be the last version I upgrade to, given the
comment that WebFrontend hasn't been updated in four years, either.

It would be very helpful to know what's missing from WebFrontend that
Mythweb has, so people don't just have to figure it out, and it would
also be useful to have some idea of how much patching Mythweb might
need. I can't offer a patch---at least, not right this second---because
I don't have PHP8 setup, and no doubt others are better at random PHP
stuff than I am anyway, but I'd be very sad if Mythweb went away without
something that at least does everything it does. (I -have- made some
private patches over the years to Mythweb, so I'm at least a little
familiar with parts of it, but I don't have a test setup for PHP8.
If someone has ideas for how to set up a minimal environment to do
that without having to installed 21.x (or equivalent), install PHP8,
and install Myth, just to see what's involved in fixing Mythweb,
that would also be handy.)
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
> On 12 Dec 2021, at 8:00 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org wrote:
>
>>> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work with the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.
>> I can't find the reference, but the last statement by the
>> devs that I recall was that mythweb was considered
>> depreciated, and that while pull requests would be
>> considered, do not expect updates/fixes.
>>
>> And there are no pull requests in the repo for php 8
>> support (and no one has indicated they are actively
>> working on it, although who knows if someone is
>> doing so).
>>
>> With the (upcoming) v32, it has been stated that the
>> plan was that a new (internal) replacement will be made
>> available which includes the equivalent functionality,
>> which is where I suspect most dev time is going towards.
>>
>>
>>
>> An alternative for those that are running newer
>> distros that use php 8 could be to build your
>> own php 7 (likely painful) or run a container
>> with apache and php 7 (lots of recipes out there
>> to do so).
>
>
> There was a PR but looks like it got closed because of an undisclosed
> issue with it.
>
> https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/issues/63 <https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/issues/63>
>
>
> The hope is to retire MythWeb and create a new web frontend that as well
> as incorporating the features of MythWeb and/or WebFrontend it would
> also incorporate a new Web Setup stuff allowing the backend to be
> configured from a browser or another client that uses the Services API
> so mythtv-setup can be removed.
>
>
> The current plan is to write the new web backend using Angular that will
> use the Services API exclusively and not require direct access to the
> MythTV database or the Myth protocol.
>
>
> If there are any developers familiar with Angular would like to help out
> with this then please get in touch :)

Some time ago I very rudely described WebFrontend as being for the mobile phone set.
I too use MythWeb exclusively because it just works.

I want a tool that does my task, with a minimum of fuss and without impressing me as to how clever or artisticly talented the programmers are. If WebFrontend meets those critera then good else we have a situtation where developer talent is diluted trying to maintain MythWeb

James
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12-12-2021 13:20, James wrote:
>> On 12 Dec 2021, at 8:00 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org
>> <mailto:mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org> wrote:
>>
>>>> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work
>>>> with the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.
>>> I can't find the reference, but the last statement by the
>>> devs that I recall was that mythweb was considered
>>> depreciated, and that while pull requests would be
>>> considered, do not expect updates/fixes.
>>>
>>> And there are no pull requests in the repo for php 8
>>> support (and no one has indicated they are actively
>>> working on it, although who knows if someone is
>>> doing so).
>>>
>>> With the (upcoming) v32, it has been stated that the
>>> plan was that a new (internal) replacement will be made
>>> available which includes the equivalent functionality,
>>> which is where I suspect most dev time is going towards.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> An alternative for those that are running newer
>>> distros that use php 8 could be to build your
>>> own php 7 (likely painful) or run a container
>>> with apache and php 7 (lots of recipes out there
>>> to do so).
>>
>>
>> There was a PR but looks like it got closed because of an undisclosed
>> issue with it.
>>
>> https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/issues/63
>> <https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/issues/63>
>>
>>
>> The hope is to retire MythWeb and create a new web frontend that as well
>> as incorporating the features of MythWeb and/or WebFrontend it would
>> also incorporate a new Web Setup stuff allowing the backend to be
>> configured from a browser or another client that uses the Services API
>> so mythtv-setup can be removed.
>>
>>
>> The current plan is to write the new web backend using Angular that will
>> use the Services API exclusively and not require direct access to the
>> MythTV database or the Myth protocol.
>>
>>
>> If there are any developers familiar with Angular would like to help out
>> with this then please get in touch :)
>
> Some time ago I very rudely described WebFrontend as being for the
> mobile phone set.
> I too use MythWeb exclusively because it just works.
>
> I want a tool that does my task, with a minimum of fuss and without
> impressing me as to how clever or artisticly talented the programmers
> are. If WebFrontend meets those critera ?then good else we have a
> situtation where developer talent is diluted trying to maintain MythWeb
>
>
in my quick testing from yesterday webfrontend on 31 results in many
crashes. mythweb simply works

Cheers

Rudy
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/12/2021 12:37, Rudy Zijlstra wrote:

>
>
> On 12-12-2021 13:20, James wrote:
>>> On 12 Dec 2021, at 8:00 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org
>>> <mailto:mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work
>>>>> with the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.
>>>> I can't find the reference, but the last statement by the
>>>> devs that I recall was that mythweb was considered
>>>> depreciated, and that while pull requests would be
>>>> considered, do not expect updates/fixes.
>>>>
>>>> And there are no pull requests in the repo for php 8
>>>> support (and no one has indicated they are actively
>>>> working on it, although who knows if someone is
>>>> doing so).
>>>>
>>>> With the (upcoming) v32, it has been stated that the
>>>> plan was that a new (internal) replacement will be made
>>>> available which includes the equivalent functionality,
>>>> which is where I suspect most dev time is going towards.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> An alternative for those that are running newer
>>>> distros that use php 8 could be to build your
>>>> own php 7 (likely painful) or run a container
>>>> with apache and php 7 (lots of recipes out there
>>>> to do so).
>>>
>>>
>>> There was a PR but looks like it got closed because of an undisclosed
>>> issue with it.
>>>
>>> https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/issues/63
>>> <https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/issues/63>
>>>
>>>
>>> The hope is to retire MythWeb and create a new web frontend that as well
>>> as incorporating the features of MythWeb and/or WebFrontend it would
>>> also incorporate a new Web Setup stuff allowing the backend to be
>>> configured from a browser or another client that uses the Services API
>>> so mythtv-setup can be removed.
>>>
>>>
>>> The current plan is to write the new web backend using Angular that will
>>> use the Services API exclusively and not require direct access to the
>>> MythTV database or the Myth protocol.
>>>
>>>
>>> If there are any developers familiar with Angular would like to help out
>>> with this then please get in touch :)
>>
>> Some time ago I very rudely described WebFrontend as being for the
>> mobile phone set.
>> I too use MythWeb exclusively because it just works.
>>
>> I want a tool that does my task, with a minimum of fuss and without
>> impressing me as to how clever or artisticly talented the programmers
>> are. If WebFrontend meets those critera ?then good else we have a
>> situtation where developer talent is diluted trying to maintain MythWeb
>>
>>
> in my quick testing from yesterday webfrontend on 31 results in many
> crashes. mythweb simply works
>
> Cheers
>
> Rudy
>

I think I need to clear something up both MythWeb and the current
WebFrontend are depreciated and will be replaced by the new WebFrontend
that will also incorporate the new Web Setup stuff. Exactly how that
will look like and feel like is undecided. It will likely use Angular
and Material but even that is open for discussion.


Like I've said before I don't use either, for me it dilutes what MythTV
was originally supposed to be :( .


All I'm trying to do is to move things along and get devs and users
motivated to work on it. It's hard enough to get people motivated and
the negative vibe from this thread really isn't going to improve that.


Paul H.
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
> On 12 Dec 2021, at 8:00 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org wrote:
>
> The current plan is to write the new web backend using Angular that will
> use the Services API exclusively and not require direct access to the
> MythTV database or the Myth protocol.
>
>
> If there are any developers familiar with Angular would like to help out
> with this then please get in touch :)

I've not played with either, so my question is bona-fide:

Why would WebFrontEnd not just be a compiled QT companion app to mythtv.
It seems that QT has all the bits to make a sever and all the network goodies to interact with the API. Heck you could even easily have a web player as part of it and host the app on linux/mac/winders/android/ios without any drama. The biggest heartaches of MythWeb have been getting all the bits together for this arbitary platform.
I'm not sure java answers the question 'Oh sherbit jdk on your ancient ipad does not have wizbang that we need.'
The #1 goal ought to be 'make it easy for the users, while keeping it interesting for the devs' not 'easy for the devs, to hell with those users who don't toe the line.

EG ask John Hoyt how he has struggled with the python metadata grabber bits on his macOS mythfrontend.
James
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
>
> EG ask John Hoyt how he has struggled with the python metadata grabber
> bits on his macOS mythfrontend.
>

I wouldn't quite say I struggle with them. :) They work for me on my macs
and I cannot reproduce your local errors so I stopped trying to "fix" what
I could not prove was broken.
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/12/2021 12:54, James wrote:

>
>
>> On 12 Dec 2021, at 8:00 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org
>> <mailto:mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org> wrote:
>>
>> The current plan is to write the new web backend using Angular that will
>> use the Services API exclusively and not require direct access to the
>> MythTV database or the Myth protocol.
>>
>>
>> If there are any developers familiar with Angular would like to help out
>> with this then please get in touch :)
>
> I've not played with either, so my question is bona-fide:
>
> Why would WebFrontEnd not just be a compiled QT companion app to mythtv.
> It seems that QT has all the bits to make a sever and all the network
> goodies to interact with the API. Heck you could even easily have a
> web player as part of it and host the app on
> linux/mac/winders/android/ios without any drama. The biggest
> heartaches of MythWeb have been getting all the bits together for this
> arbitary platform.
> I'm not sure java answers the question 'Oh sherbit jdk on your ancient
> ipad does not have wizbang that we need.'
> The #1 goal ought to be 'make it easy for the users, while keeping it
> interesting for the devs' not 'easy for the devs, to hell with those
> users who don't toe the line.
>
> EG ask John Hoyt how he has struggled with the python metadata grabber
> bits on his macOS mythfrontend.
> James
>

I'm not really involved with it's development but from what I know
mythbackend will run the webserver,? just like it does for the
WebFrontend now,? internally which is all c++ and uses the Qt networking
where possible. The advantage there is zero setup to do. You just
install the backend and then you can run any web browser and point it to
the host and port the backend is serving the content on. From what I
understand the way Angular works most of the app runs on the web browser
the server just serves the data it uses to create the webpages.? I
believe Angular is a Google product and they seem to know a thing or two
about writing web apps?


Paul H.
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On Sunday, 12 December 2021 12:20:10 GMT James wrote:
> Some time ago I very rudely described WebFrontend as being for the mobile
> phone set. I too use MythWeb exclusively because it just works.

Which is ironic since it doesn't work on a mobile phone. The design isn't
properly responsive so it's pretty much impossible to use on a mobile browser.

Are we talking of the same thing?

http://{backend_ip}:6544/ ?

Of course with the ripping out of the QtScript support I've no idea if this is
even functional in the current dev build. Though it's been in MythTV for
years, it still surprises me how few people know of it's existence.

> I want a tool that does my task, with a minimum of fuss and without
> impressing me as to how clever or artisticly talented the programmers are.
> If WebFrontend meets those critera then good else we have a situtation
> where developer talent is diluted trying to maintain MythWeb

Again, not sure if we're talking of the same thing here. No-one has ever
described me as artistic or clever.

--
Stuart Morgan


_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
To try to keep this a little on-track, I took a look at the thread on
-users from about a month ago (which I hadn't noticed at the time) and
it may be that simply commenting out the errant line might at least
let things proceed, though I have no idea if it might hit another issue.
[.I've suggested that the OP might try that and report back; I wish I'd
noticed that in a more timely manner, but hopefully he will.]

It also occurs to me that it may be possible to set up a test framework
for this by installing Ubuntu 21.x/PHP8 anywhere (not necessarily on a
running, older backend) and experimenting that way. So it seems like
maybe it would be possible to install the mythbackend package & apache
on some other host, don't start the backend there, and tell MW which
host it should be talking to. I haven't tried this or looked at it very
hard, but maybe this would make it possible to create an enviroment for
debugging this without affecting a running installation.*

Does this seem reasonable?

* (Or, I suppose, just normally install mythbackend on a new host and
don't even bother trying to record from it and see if MW works at all,
but it'd still need a bunch of configuration to test scheduling etc
because it'd need some tuners and program sources, etc.)
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 11/12/2021 17:06, Bill Meek wrote:

>
> There was a PR, but the author closed it. I did test it (lightly)
> and all pages worked. But the author found that searches failed.
>
> https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/pull/62
>
> I just went to the top level pages and scheduled one recording with
> no problems.


This was me.  I made a bunch of light changes and found that majority of
functionality worked following some similarly light testing (it's hard
to fully test MythWeb as a bunch of the code is quite crusty).  However,
my testing was a little too light as the searching failed
:embarrassed:.  I'm hoping to find some time to unpick this over the
next few weeks.  Like others I find MythWeb very useful and I'd like to
keep it alive if we can do it without massive changes.


Nige.


_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/12/2021 19:11, Nigel Jewell wrote:
> On 11/12/2021 17:06, Bill Meek wrote:
>
>>
>> There was a PR, but the author closed it. I did test it (lightly)
>> and all pages worked. But the author found that searches failed.
>>
>>    https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/pull/62
>>
>> I just went to the top level pages and scheduled one recording with
>> no problems.
>
>
> This was me.  I made a bunch of light changes and found that majority
> of functionality worked following some similarly light testing (it's
> hard to fully test MythWeb as a bunch of the code is quite crusty). 
> However, my testing was a little too light as the searching failed
> :embarrassed:.  I'm hoping to find some time to unpick this over the
> next few weeks.  Like others I find MythWeb very useful and I'd like
> to keep it alive if we can do it without massive changes.


In fact; I've just fixed it ;)  Funny what seeing some interest from
others does for motivation.

I'll do some more testing and then raise another pull request.

Nige.

_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
> On 12 Dec 2021, at 9:22 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org wrote:
>
>
> I think I need to clear something up both MythWeb and the current
> WebFrontend are depreciated and will be replaced by the new WebFrontend
> that will also incorporate the new Web Setup stuff. Exactly how that
> will look like and feel like is undecided. It will likely use Angular
> and Material but even that is open for discussion.
>
>
> Like I've said before I don't use either, for me it dilutes what MythTV
> was originally supposed to be :( .
>
>
> All I'm trying to do is to move things along and get devs and users
> motivated to work on it. It's hard enough to get people motivated and
> the negative vibe from this thread really isn't going to improve that.

Paul I don't think negative vibes are being heaped here, you are just getting response that says this is an important tool. Depreciating it in favour of something yet to be invented is politically hard to do.

Perhaps along lines of 'lets depreciate MythWeb and all it's warts. What shall we do instead?'
For me the functionality of MythWeb is just fine. Offhand I have no favourite dislikes.
James
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/12/2021 22:31, James wrote:

>
>
>> On 12 Dec 2021, at 9:22 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org
>> <mailto:mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I think I need to clear something up both MythWeb and the current
>> WebFrontend are depreciated and will be replaced by the new WebFrontend
>> that will also incorporate the new Web Setup stuff. Exactly how that
>> will look like and feel like is undecided. It will likely use Angular
>> and Material but even that is open for discussion.
>>
>>
>> Like I've said before I don't use either, for me it dilutes what MythTV
>> was originally supposed to be :( .
>>
>>
>> All I'm trying to do is to move things along and get devs and users
>> motivated to work on it. It's hard enough to get people motivated and
>> the negative vibe from this thread really isn't going to improve that.
>
> Paul I don't think negative vibes are being heaped here, you are just
> getting response that says this is an important tool. Depreciating it
> in favour of something yet to be invented is politically hard to do.
>
> Perhaps along lines of 'lets depreciate MythWeb and all it's warts.
> What shall we do instead?'
> For me the functionality of MythWeb is just fine. Offhand I have no
> favourite dislikes.
> James
>

James I do understand some people don't like change it upsets some
people but sometimes that change can be for the better :)


We are not completely fuck-wits and wont remove MythWeb until the new
web server is complete, I don't think anyone has said that was ever the
plan?,? but it is depreciated and it's unlikely to get many major
updates. If MythWeb has it's supporters then it is highly likely someone
will care enough to provide fixes for the current issues and of cause
the patches will be committed to keep MythWeb going.


I didn't explain why the WebFrontend needs rewriting one major reason is
because it and the webserver uses QtScript which has been depreciated in
Qt5 for some time and has been removed from Qt6 altogether. Qt6 is
already at version 6.2 and is now mostly complete.? I think 6.2 is or
will be an LTS release so it is likely to be included in many more
distros so the change has been forced on us it wasn't by choice.? I hope
you can appreciate the reason behind it.


Could we continue to use MythWeb as a base? Probably but since it is
ancient and uses old technology like php which runs on the server side
those that are doing the work decided since the WebFrontend and MythWeb
need updating anyway why not move to some new technology like Angular
and Material. Is that a good choice I don't know it's not me working on
it and I respect the opinion of those that are doing the work to let
them use what they want.? I have done several websites and used php on
all of them? just because it's what I know but it does slow a busy site
down because it runs on the server not the client unlike many of the
current frameworks like Angular which pushes more of the work onto the
client side. At the end of the day it should be up to the ones doing the
work to decide :)


I briefly touched on it earlier in the thread but another reason for the
change is so that the functionality of what mythtv-setup provides will
be available in the new Web Server so you can configure your backend
from any web browser potentially from any where in the world. So
basically the backend machine can become a true headless server with no
need for an UI to run to it.


I'm really not trying to piss anyone off. All I'm trying to do is put
people in the picture of what the plan is and why.


Paul H.
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/12/2021 7:36 PM, Paul Harrison wrote:
>
> On 12/12/2021 22:31, James wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>> On 12 Dec 2021, at 9:22 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I think I need to clear something up both MythWeb and the current
>>> WebFrontend are depreciated and will be replaced by the new WebFrontend
>>> that will also incorporate the new Web Setup stuff. Exactly how that
>>> will look like and feel like is undecided. It will likely use Angular
>>> and Material but even that is open for discussion.
>>>
>>>
>>> Like I've said before I don't use either, for me it dilutes what MythTV
>>> was originally supposed to be :( .
>>>
>>>
>>> All I'm trying to do is to move things along and get devs and users
>>> motivated to work on it. It's hard enough to get people motivated and
>>> the negative vibe from this thread really isn't going to improve that.
>>
>> Paul I don't think negative vibes are being heaped here, you are just
>> getting response that says this is an important tool. Depreciating it
>> in favour of something yet to be invented is politically hard to do.
>>
>> Perhaps along lines of 'lets depreciate MythWeb and all it's warts.
>> What shall we do instead?'
>> For me the functionality of MythWeb is just fine. Offhand I have no
>> favourite dislikes.
>> James
>>
>
> James I do understand some people don't like change it upsets some
> people but sometimes that change can be for the better :)
>
>
> We are not completely fuck-wits and wont remove MythWeb until the new
> web server is complete, I don't think anyone has said that was ever
> the plan?,  but it is depreciated and it's unlikely to get many major
> updates. If MythWeb has it's supporters then it is highly likely
> someone will care enough to provide fixes for the current issues and
> of cause the patches will be committed to keep MythWeb going.
>
>
> I didn't explain why the WebFrontend needs rewriting one major reason
> is because it and the webserver uses QtScript which has been
> depreciated in Qt5 for some time and has been removed from Qt6
> altogether. Qt6 is already at version 6.2 and is now mostly complete. 
> I think 6.2 is or will be an LTS release so it is likely to be
> included in many more distros so the change has been forced on us it
> wasn't by choice.  I hope you can appreciate the reason behind it.
>
>
> Could we continue to use MythWeb as a base? Probably but since it is
> ancient and uses old technology like php which runs on the server side
> those that are doing the work decided since the WebFrontend and
> MythWeb need updating anyway why not move to some new technology like
> Angular and Material. Is that a good choice I don't know it's not me
> working on it and I respect the opinion of those that are doing the
> work to let them use what they want.  I have done several websites and
> used php on all of them  just because it's what I know but it does
> slow a busy site down because it runs on the server not the client
> unlike many of the current frameworks like Angular which pushes more
> of the work onto the client side. At the end of the day it should be
> up to the ones doing the work to decide :)
>
>
> I briefly touched on it earlier in the thread but another reason for
> the change is so that the functionality of what mythtv-setup provides
> will be available in the new Web Server so you can configure your
> backend from any web browser potentially from any where in the world.
> So basically the backend machine can become a true headless server
> with no need for an UI to run to it.
>
>
> I'm really not trying to piss anyone off. All I'm trying to do is put
> people in the picture of what the plan is and why.
>
>
> Paul H.
>
>

If I understand correctly, WebFrontend won't depend on apache or nginx,
right? In that case, will it still be possible to configure a reverse
proxy on a non-mythtv machine running apache or nginx to expose
WebFrontend to the internet? I'd prefer not to have to use a VPN to get
to it when I'm not at home.
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On Sun, 12 Dec 2021 22:53:31 -0500, you wrote:

>If I understand correctly, WebFrontend won't depend on apache or nginx,
>right? In that case, will it still be possible to configure a reverse
>proxy on a non-mythtv machine running apache or nginx to expose
>WebFrontend to the internet? I'd prefer not to have to use a VPN to get
>to it when I'm not at home.

Anything that runs on a TCP port can be proxied. But I would still
highly recommend using a VPN like OpenVPN or Wireguard instead. They
are fully secure, where a proxy is inherently not so secure. Once you
have put in the (significant) effort to make a VPN work, it is simple
to use, and gives you full access to your home network, not just to
one port. I have OpenVPN clients on all my devices (phone, tablet,
laptop), and they are just click to turn on and click to turn off
again. But I do pay to have static IP addresses, which makes doing a
VPN server easier.
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/12/2021 19:40, Nigel Jewell wrote:

>
> In fact; I've just fixed it ;)  Funny what seeing some interest from
> others does for motivation.
>
> I'll do some more testing and then raise another pull request.


https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/pull/64


I'm happy to seek out and fix any other issues that are found. The
changes are relatively minor and written in a way so that MythWeb works
fine on PHP 7.4 and 8.0.


Nige.

_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 12/12/2021 12:20, James wrote:
>> On 12 Dec 2021, at 8:00 pm, mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org
>> <mailto:mythtv-dev-request@mythtv.org> wrote:
>>
>>>> Before formally retiring mythweb on RPM Fusion as it doesn't work
>>>> with the latest PHP I wanted to confirm that it will not be updated.

Please can people who have a php8 setup, and also those with a php7
setup try the patches in the PR associated with the open issue [1]
and report your feedback on that issue tracker.

I just do not have the time to test it!

Regards
Stuart


[1] - https://github.com/MythTV/mythweb/issues/63
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org
Re: Time to retire mythweb? [ In reply to ]
On 13/12/2021 03:53, faginbagin wrote:
>
> If I understand correctly, WebFrontend won't depend on apache or nginx,
> right? In that case, will it still be possible to configure a reverse
> proxy on a non-mythtv machine running apache or nginx to expose
> WebFrontend to the internet? I'd prefer not to have to use a VPN to get
> to it when I'm not at home.
>

That's on the required features list :-p


Regards
Stuart
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev@mythtv.org
http://lists.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
http://wiki.mythtv.org/Mailing_List_etiquette
MythTV Forums: https://forum.mythtv.org

1 2  View All